OT: What's Next for Borderland Sports?

minermx07

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It's been an exciting few years. AAA baseball is a success. USL soccer seems to be a success. Juarez just got a first division soccer team. Do you guys see anything else in the future?

Some possibilities that come to mind are AHL Hockey if we can get an arena. Mexican League Baseball for Juarez. Anything else that we can realistically get.

I think Mountain Star Sports really thinks they can one day get the MLS with El Paso being the little market that just supports their team like hell like the Thunder in the NBA or Packers in the NFL. I don't think MLS executives are likely to agree to that arguement though.
 
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JCorona

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I think the next step is to build up the teams we already have. It will start with both soccer teams getting new stadiums.

Juarez has to make the ligilla and avoid regulation at all cost. The Locomotive have to continue their excellent form and make a playoff run.

If Mountain Star can get the teams on both sides of the border winning championships and selling out stadiums it will get the attention of the mls.
 

unihorn

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Ft. Worth is about to finish their new “Dickies Arena.” Can we get ours?
 

Minerforlife

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I think the next step is to build up the teams we already have. It will start with both soccer teams getting new stadiums.

Juarez has to make the ligilla and avoid regulation at all cost. The Locomotive have to continue their excellent form and make a playoff run.

If Mountain Star can get the teams on both sides of the border winning championships and selling out stadiums it will get the attention of the mls.

I think it's probably 15 years to late. The MLS is will make another round of expansion that's it. El Paso has serious market issues that would almost certainly be a non starter. El Paso is growing at a much slower rate than the other Texas metro areas. Economic investment per capita income are also vastly lower. 15 years a go w when MLS was floundering they considered adding markets like Rochester and Charelston. That would have El Paso's chance. Now it's about the big markets. It doesnt help that Albuquerque has nearly double the attendance that El Paso's USL team has. They also have two very large supporters groups and travel to road games in large numbers. I think the Locomotive have only sold out one game the opener. I think USL will be successful in El Paso. I just dont think there is any chance the MLS will ever consider El Paso. I do think the relationship between Juarez FC and the Locomitive could certainly hurt The Lovomotive brand.
 
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JCorona

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I think it's probably 15 years to late. The MLS is will make another round of expansion that's it. El Paso has serious market issues that would almost certainly be a non starter. El Paso is growing at a much slower rate than the other Texas metro areas. Economic investment per capital income are also vastly lower. 15 years a go while MLs when MLS was floundering they considered adding markets like Rochester and Charelston. That would have El Paso's chance. Now it's about the big markets. It doesnt help that Albuquerque has nearly double the attendance that El Paso's USL team has. They also have two very large supporters groups and travel to road games in large numbers. I think the Locomotive have only sold out one game the opener. I think USL will be successful in El Paso. I just dont think there is any chance the MLS will ever consider El Paso. I do think the relationship between Juarez FC and the Locomitive could certainly hurt The Lovomotive brand.
I’ve been wondering a lot lately but do you or anyone else know why El Paso never jumped on the MLS bandwagon back in 1994? The Patriots showed around that same time a lower division team could draw crowds of 15k. Had they made the investment back then El Paso would be grandfathered into the mls right now.
 

Minerforlife

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I’ve been wondering a lot lately but do you or anyone else know why El Paso never jumped on the MLS bandwagon back in 1994? The Patriots showed around that same time a lower division team could draw crowds of 15k. Had they made the investment back then El Paso would be grandfathered into the mls right now.

That's a great question. They took out 500 seat in the corners of the sun bowl almost 20 years to "soccer size" the stadium. In the last twenty years there have probably been, if you dont count the Patriots who briefly used the sun bowl as their home, 5 soccer games in the SunBowl. I dont know what the thinking was in soccer sizing the SunBowl. I think if someone would have bought the Patriots 20 years ago and put some real money behind them they could have had chance at the MLS.
 
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kickballpro

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I think the next step is to build up the teams we already have. It will start with both soccer teams getting new stadiums.

Juarez has to make the ligilla and avoid regulation at all cost. The Locomotive have to continue their excellent form and make a playoff run.

If Mountain Star can get the teams on both sides of the border winning championships and selling out stadiums it will get the attention of the mls.

I thought the Mexican league is sort of doing away with the promotion/relegation system?
 

abethagr8

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El Paso is considered to be a poor city by plenty of people with only one business in the stock market that is why the MLS hasn't come to El Paso now that does not take away that El Paso cannot bring in sports team. I eventually think the AHL will venture to here in El Paso for now we just have to keep supporting the teams we have at the moment.
 

Minerforlife

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El Paso is considered to be a poor city by plenty of people with only one business in the stock market that is why the MLS hasn't come to El Paso now that does not take away that El Paso cannot bring in sports team. I eventually think the AHL will venture to here in El Paso for now we just have to keep supporting the teams we have at the moment.

I think the AHL would be great for El Paso. I would stay away from the g-league those teams draw very few fans.
 

minermaniac2023

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I think the AHL would be great for El Paso. I would stay away from the g-league those teams draw very few fans.

The arena would host maybe 40 AHL games and then what else? Find a way to work together with UTEP. Not like this arena is getting built anytime soon.
 

kickballpro

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That's a loaded question. This year the relegated team was allowed to stay after paying a fine. Check back next year for a different answer.

Yeah and I was reading only 6 teams were eligible to be promoted because a team had to have their financial backing in order to be promoted.

They're allegedly building a new stadium in Juarez and they have strong owners. I dont see relegation in their future.
 

utep2step

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I’ve been wondering a lot lately but do you or anyone else know why El Paso never jumped on the MLS bandwagon back in 1994? The Patriots showed around that same time a lower division team could draw crowds of 15k. Had they made the investment back then El Paso would be grandfathered into the mls right now.
The economic factors and events that make it more feasible now as compared to then were not around. City politics in '94 were deeply, deeply divided as local democratic leaders bailed the party and went right (of center, but close to center) and the only two major players as far as real estate is concerned were developers (as they are still today) and El Paso water who were selling off huge portions of land for a nice profit and no one could stop them. The local GOP and Dem (that remained) leaders of El Paso fought tooth and nail on everything, even street repair and nothing forward thinking was implemented. The "Paralysis by Analysis" that plagued El Paso in the 80's and early 90's were going away and replaced by just "NO! Taxes are too high. Period!".

Then came big oil man Paul L. Foster, a brutal drug war that sent Ciudad Juarez very rich to El Paso for good, BRAC (Base Realignment and Closure) that literally changed Fort Bliss and El Paso, State of Texas highway infrastructure expansion, bigger infrastructure and program investments into UTEP, massive increase in federal law enforcement in El Paso and far west Texas (border protection), and most critically, El Paso finally voting "Yes" on city and school district improvement and quality of life projects. The day of the "No!" had met it's match. This brought in much, much, much needed money, rehabilitation of private and public buildings, neighborhoods (there were some good Fed Rehab programs that didn't come until late 90's, early 2000's), schools, roads, etc. With that comes private lending that is more willing to lend on capital improvement projects versus twenty years prior as they would have been more hesitant (they just lent on development and retail: Strip shopping popped all over. Just national trend stuff to keep lending safe). That is your difference IMO.
 
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utep2step

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The economic factors and events that make it more feasible now as compared to then were not around. City politics in '94 were deeply, deeply divided as local democratic leaders bailed the party and went right (of center, but close to center) and the only two major players as far as real estate is concerned were developers (as they are still today) and El Paso water who were selling off huge portions of land for a nice profit and no one could stop them. The local GOP and Dems (that remained) leaders of El Paso fought tooth and nail on everything, even street repair and nothing forward thinking was implemented. The "Paralysis by Analysis" that plagued El Paso in the 80's and early 90's were going away and replaced by just "NO! Taxes are too high. Period!".

Then came big oil man Paul L. Foster, a brutal drug war that sent Ciudad Juarez very rich to El Paso for good, BRAC (Base Realignment and Closure) that literally changed Fort Bliss and El Paso, State of Texas highway infrastructure expansion, bigger infrastructure and program investments into UTEP, massive increase in federal law enforcement in El Paso and far west Texas (border protection), and most critically, El Paso finally voting "Yes" on city and school district improvement and quality of life projects. The day of the "No!" had met it's match. This brought in much, much, much needed money, rehabilitation of private and public buildings, neighborhoods (there were some good Fed Rehab programs that didn't come until late 90's, early 2000's), schools, roads, etc. With that come private lending that is more willing to lend on capital improvement projects versus twenty years prior as they would have been more hesitant (they just lent on development and retail: Strip shopping popped all over. Just national trend stuff to keep lending safe). That is your difference IMO.
Northeast El Paso still votes "No" on quality of life bond measures, but looks to benefit from all of this in the long run. Go figure?!
 

JCorona

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Corona, you gotta give a person a reason to put an upper tier anything.
The thing is that back then we didn’t anything fancy. There was no 300 million franchise fee or a 200+ million downtown soccer specific stadium needed.

Like @Minerforlife said all we need was Mountain Star 25 years ago. The Sun Bowl would have worked good for a few years. We probably would have held a bunch of attendance records until the likes of Seattle and Atlanta made their way into the league.

What could have been or better yet what should have been.
 

UTEPMiners8106

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Yeah and I was reading only 6 teams were eligible to be promoted because a team had to have their financial backing in order to be promoted.

They're allegedly building a new stadium in Juarez and they have strong owners. I dont see relegation in their future.

From what I understand since Juarez bought out Lobos BUAP they took on their standing in the relegation battle. They will be sitting 3rd from the bottom because Veracruz paid a penalty to stay in the top division. They really need to build their team to be competitive right away.
 
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Randaddy Miner

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The moment Salt Lake City got a MLS team was the moment that El Paso would never get a team. A lot of people thought El Paso was a shoe in at the beginning. MLS had paid for a study and that study had El Paso ranked at the top of cities for expansion. Nike came into soccer and their marketing department determined the patriots would be the first team in the United States sponsored by Nike. El Paso (with primarily local players) had just gone to the final of the Open Cup and had really good attendance figures. The El Paso youth programs were tops in the nation.

The problem was nobody stepped up to get a team. Rumor was that the owner of the patriots was trying to sell the team so it could get the financial backing to move to MLS. They were renting Dudley field and it was falling apart and the city didn't want to build a stadium for them. Also, the owner of the patriots wasn't really doing it to make a profit, all he wanted was a team so his brother and then (years later on) his son would have a team to play for. Some players were complaining that they weren't getting paid. The straw that broke the camel's back was with the local youth players who graduated high school between 93-98, some of those kids who stayed in El Paso signed with the patriots and when some MLS teams came to El Paso to get players for their teams, the patriots front office wouldn't release them from their contracts to play in the MLS, I guess that didn't sit well with MLS and everything else is history, it all became about markets. Local talent nor support mattered anymore
 
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FiliUTEP

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Why doesnt el paso get good go Golf Tournaments ? Also what about Nascar? El paso has the space for a racetrack. I think people from Juarez would come to a Nascar race.
 

UTEPMiners8106

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Why doesnt el paso get good go Golf Tournaments ? Also what about Nascar? El paso has the space for a racetrack. I think people from Juarez would come to a Nascar race.

We can’t even build an arena. Texas Motor Speedway seats 181k. I read where the speedway hosts a lot of lower level races and some major music festivals.
 

TxRdKiller

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Why doesnt el paso get good go Golf Tournaments ? Also what about Nascar? El paso has the space for a racetrack. I think people from Juarez would come to a Nascar race.

Serious question. Is there a study somewhere that shows how much support El Paso would really get from Juarez? What's the average disposable income over there? How much of their population can afford the cost of U.S. based events?

In addition, most of you guys hate the aggies and they're only 40 miles up the road. I realize Juarez is just across the river but it's a different country. They have their own local teams and many great teams elsewhere in Mexico that they love and support. We can't (won't) even support a school 40 miles away when they're in the NCAA tournament every year.

Why would Mexicans be inclined to support a team from a country where they are reviled, especially at the highest level of our government? I'm kinda hating my own country right now and I'm a U.S. born citizen. If I were Mexican I'd be saying "f*ck those a$$holes in the U.S. They can support their own $hitty teams."
 
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utep2step

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The thing is that back then we didn’t anything fancy. There was no 300 million franchise fee or a 200+ million downtown soccer specific stadium needed.

Like @Minerforlife said all we need was Mountain Star 25 years ago. The Sun Bowl would have worked good for a few years. We probably would have held a bunch of attendance records until the likes of Seattle and Atlanta made their way into the league.

What could have been or better yet what should have been.
El Paso has Mountain Star because Foster fell in love with a gal from Ciudad Juarez, right?. Things happen beyond business view. Whatever it takes.
 
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jdubb66

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Serious question. Is there a study somewhere that shows how much support El Paso would really get from Juarez? What's the average disposable income over there? How much of their population can afford the cost of U.S. based events?

In addition, most of you guys hate the aggies and they're only 40 miles up the road. I realize Juarez is just across the river but it's a different country. They have their own local teams and many great teams elsewhere in Mexico that they love and support. We can't (won't) even support a school 40 miles away when they're in the NCAA tournament every year.

Why would Mexicans be inclined to support a team from a country where they are reviled, especially at the highest level of our government? I'm kinda hating my own country right now and I'm a U.S. born citizen. If I were Mexican I'd be saying "f*ck those a$$holes in the U.S. They can support their own $hitty teams."
Mexico travels better than just about any other country on the planet. They took a bus to Russia for cripes sake. If our team had Mexican players or players from Juarez, which there are many there at the professional leverl, they would come.
 

UTEPMiners8106

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Serious question. Is there a study somewhere that shows how much support El Paso would really get from Juarez? What's the average disposable income over there? How much of their population can afford the cost of U.S. based events?

In addition, most of you guys hate the aggies and they're only 40 miles up the road. I realize Juarez is just across the river but it's a different country. They have their own local teams and many great teams elsewhere in Mexico that they love and support. We can't (won't) even support a school 40 miles away when they're in the NCAA tournament every year.

Why would Mexicans be inclined to support a team from a country where they are reviled, especially at the highest level of our government? I'm kinda hating my own country right now and I'm a U.S. born citizen. If I were Mexican I'd be saying "f*ck those a$$holes in the U.S. They can support their own $hitty teams."

With that being said I would love for someone to point out an event in EP that Juarez has come out in full force. Aside from concerts I can’t think of many.
 
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FiliUTEP

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With that being said I would love for someone to point out an event in EP that Juarez has come out in full force. Aside from concerts I can’t think of many.


Isnt Nascar and Formula 1 huge in Mexico? I think its about time El Paso and Juarez start working together.
 

UTEPMiners8106

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Isnt Nascar and Formula 1 huge in Mexico? I think its about time El Paso and Juarez start working together.
This year is the last year of the Mexico Grand Prix. They invested the money elsewhere.

From what I read there is a NASCAR race series in Mexico but since I don’t frequent Mexico I would not know how popular the sport is.
 
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JCorona

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How can one even tell whether the people in attendance are there from Mexico, Texas , or New Mexico?

Anyway if it’s an important event Mexico fans will travel. During the CCL Tigres fans completely took over Houston. Every single Mexico soccer game in the USA is near capacity or sold out. We’re not talking about those cute 20k stadiums MLS teams have trouble selling out. How many are Mexican-Americans and how many are Mexicans that want to see their country play? FMF has basically eliminated any non WC qualifying game from being played in Mexico. Big fights also bring the Mexicans in full force to the USA.

If we take concerts out then what major event has El Paso held? I know for a fact there was a heavy Juarez influence at the JCCjr fight. Most of the friendly soccer games I attended in EP were organized with Juarez in mind. If they hadn’t crossed the border the pathetic attendance would have been even worse without them.
 
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jdubb66

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A bus. To Russia. hehe... hehehehe... hahahahahaha... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
mexican-super-fans-pimp-school-bus-journey-across-europe-world-cup.jpg
 

TxRdKiller

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I know for a fact there was a heavy Juarez influence at the JCCjr fight.

Then where are the official numbers to support your statement? I asked earlier about studies to show just how well Mexican citizens from Juarez will really support U.S. events.

I doubt most on this board really know but you know who has looked at studies relevant to Mexican support in El Paso? The city and developers looking for a place to invest their money. And if it hasn't happened it's because the numbers don't support the investment.
 
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JCorona

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Then where are the official numbers to support your statement? I asked earlier about studies to show just how well Mexican citizens from Juarez will really support U.S. events.

I doubt most on this board really know but you know who has looked at studies relevant to Mexican support in El Paso? The city and developers looking for a place to invest their money. And if it hasn't happened it's because the numbers don't support the investment.
I don’t know numbers. But I do know Mexico supports American sporting events. Do you which city holds the record for the highest attended NFL game?

Hint: It’s not a city in America.
 

TxRdKiller

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I don’t know numbers. But I do know Mexico supports American sporting events. Do you which city holds the record for the highest attended NFL game?

Hint: It’s not a city in America.

Bingo! They supported the game -- wait for it -- in MEXICO! Not in El Paso or any other U.S. city!
 
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