Corona great point. You've echoed my sentiments exactly. The only way to improve basketball is to improve football.
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Corona great point. You've echoed my sentiments exactly. The only way to improve basketball is to improve football.
that’s dumb. Alabama has played in bowl games and won multiple national titles since 2004. Their basketball team has made 2 NCAA tournaments from 2007-2019. There no correlation between football success and basketball success.
It's funny that UConn decided to go in the exact opposite direction.
UCONN is a blueblood. They were covered by the Big East their former home. They joined a top five conference. We arent a blue blood. If we joined a basketball conference it would be The WAC or The Southland.
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That's a dumb compared. Alabama is in a power five conference. We are are in an fbs g5 conference. Football is the king and how you move up in the world. NMSU is one of the top five mid major programs every year and dont have a conference because their football program sucks.
We were only 7 years removed from our "glory years" in hoops when the MWC was formed. We were left behind because of football and our basketball program wasnt as good as we all thought it was. Our history and tradition in hoops have been constantly inflated il to the detriment of the entire athletic department.
We play in a one bid league where the regular season is meaningless. If we win the tourney and get a 14 seed it's not going to push needle. For basketball to progress we need a better conference. To get a better conference we have to win at football period.
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You said that improving in football is the only way to improve basketball. The best college football team over the last decade, has a poor basketball program. If it doesn’t work for them, why would it work for anyone else?
How is Boise State’s basketball program? How has their football program improved their basketball?
Conference alignment is another story. Yes, it would help if UTEP had a good football team, but we don’t even have a good basketball team. And that doesn’t mean the basketball program would improve if the football team did.
A basketball coach will improve the basketball team and a football coach will improve the football team. The football coach will not improve the basketball team. Case and point, is Alabama.
How is Boise State’s basketball program? How has their football program improved their basketball?
Conference alignment is another story. Yes, it would help if UTEP had a good football team, but we don’t even have a good basketball team. And that doesn’t mean the basketball program would improve if the football team did.
A basketball coach will improve the basketball team and a football coach will improve the football team. The football coach will not improve the basketball team. Case and point, is Alabama.
When the athletic budget is 80 million and donations are at an all time low of 2 million compared to 10 million during the big east years those kinds of decisions make sense.
You have to have a better conference to have any shot a being a perennial tourney team. We play in an invisible hoops conference. Our attendance is at an all-time low. This job will always be a stepping stone unless we get a better conference. L
If they really were, then the would win an NCAA Tourney game every once in a while.
All they are is the best team in the WAC.
Alabama basketball has had a decent run the last decade. They've won 193 games. That’s a little above 19 wins per season. Only one losing season. 6 NIT bids that includes a run to the championship game. 2 NCAA tournaments with one win.
I don’t think those are achievements of a poor basketball program.
Is that because of their football program or the fact that they had or have a better basketball coach than we do?
Okay, meddling or just okay. Do Power conference schools care about making the NIT?
The football program has raised the profile of the athletic department. That makes the job more attractive, increases donations for hoops. They go hand in hand.
Boise has 3 NCAA Tournament appearances since 1994, all losses and have 2 Regular Season Conference Titles. So much better than UTEP right????
Two of thos tourney appearance came within the last six years. They also have two nit appearances in the same time frame. I dont put any stock at all in NIT appearances but some on this board do. So yes their is farvsupperior to ours. Plus they play in a multi bid league which helps.
They play in a multi bid league, but don’t make it very often. Good thing they have their football team makes their basketball team better. All this time I thought it was coaching and recruiting.
That's not exactly how it happened. UConn knew it needed to be in FBS and former coach Calhoun was all for them because he realized the importance of having a FBS program to support their basketball program. They built a new stadium and moved up.
I'm talking about the recent news, that they're throwing their football program under the bus (leaving the AAC) so that their basketball team can join the Big East.
"We are a Basketball School By HEART"!!!!!! I then clearly said we haven't had the success we were once used to when Haskins was here. The Dallas Cowboys haven't been to a SB in a 100 years (Exaggeration) However do they have a proud Football History and is Dallas a Cowboys town over the Mavericks? Yes, Why, because it has the more successful history. El Paso, at least the generation that I grew up with and ones before me, want a successful Basketball Program first. If football does great, it's a bonus. I don't care what you young so called UTEP fans say, UTEP has a Basketball History. If you don't realize that, you don't know College Basketball. Even announcers Nationally point to this history hopefully one day returning. So my point is very simple. If we get Basketball back to where it once was making post season every year like we should, then Football is just what it has always been. That is a cherry on top when they win and if not, oh well that just UTEP Football.
No doubt a succesful football program brings in $$$ and positive attention for a university. But improvement in a basketball program is based more on how much a university is willing to commit to the basketball program. UTEP's football program is a joke, but Rodney Terry is going to have a higher base salary than Boise State's Leon Rice this year. UTEP pays the mens BB coach more than the head football coach( IMO, very stupid). UTEP raising the mens BB coach salary to 750k shows it is fully committed to improving the basketball program even with having one of the worst football programs.
The only way for UTEP to get into the MW is if we have a successful FB program and we desperately need to get into the MW. But the MW's days of getting 3 bids into the NCAA Tourney are long gone with the stupid Selection Committee finding every reason for .500 caliber P5 schools to get into the Tourney and reducing the number of at large G5 school bids. The MW is a 2 bid league. Sure it is better than a 1 bid league like CUSA, but it is still going to be difficult to make the NCAA Tourney in the MW. Fresno State finished 23-9 last year and 13-5 in the MW, and had zero chance to get an at large bid. You make it seem like if we win 20 games in MW we are going to the NCAA Tourney.
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By no means is an at large a guarantee in the MWC. However, at least theres a chance. In cusa there is no chance. The regular season is irrelevant. You cant build a great bball program in a one bid league.
Well ya 2 is better than 1, but the odds are still stacked up against you like a 1 bid league. If you don't finish a top 2 MW team, you still don't really have a chance as well. It is just very difficult to have any chance at an at large bid now days if you are a G5 school. NMSU is in a 1 bid league, didn't you just say they are a top 5 mid-major program???
All that says is that Boise St has the same commitment to basketball as UTEP. The pay for the head coaches is similar.
Terry $725,000
Rice $725,000
The only difference is that Boise St put football first and now they can afford to pay their football coach double what they pay their basketball coach.
We had an FBS football head start on Boise St. Now look how far apart the two programs are.
Our priorities have always been basketball. Since the retirement of Haskins this strategy has backfired. Sure we have had a few bright moments here and there but they weren’t worth the end outcome it netted us.
The pattern continues of paying the basketball coach the same or more than the football coach.
With major realignment a few years away let’s hope this strategy finally works and we don’t end up in CUSA 4.0 fighting tooth and nail vs our new conference rivals Houston Baptist and Incarnate Word.
Terry $725,000
Rice $725,000
The only difference is that Boise St put football first and now they can afford to pay their football coach double what they pay their basketball coach.
We had an FBS football head start on Boise St. Now look how far apart the two programs are.
Our priorities have always been basketball. Since the retirement of Haskins this strategy has backfired. Sure we have had a few bright moments here and there but they weren’t worth the end outcome it netted us.
The pattern continues of paying the basketball coach the same or more than the football coach.
With major realignment a few years away let’s hope this strategy finally works and we don’t end up in CUSA 4.0 fighting tooth and nail vs our new conference rivals Houston Baptist and Incarnate Word.
Then why for Haskins 30 years plus of success, the Football team sucked??? Riddle me that?
That was a completely different era of basketball. Back in the day 20 wins in the WAC got you in tourney. Now you can win 28 games in C-USA and if you lose the conference tourney you're going to the NIT. There are more teams and conferences now. Back in Haskins era alot of power five schools weren't putting money into basketball. In Texas in 80's you had the Houston Cougars who were far and away the team of the decade in Texas and then everyone else. Now all those schools have invested in hoops. There has been a huge split in the last 10 years in college basketball. The split in college basketball is even greater than it football. Basically every school with pedigree and tradition are in ten conferences. Meanwhile we are in mid major low major purgatory. Attendance is at an all time low. It's always been boosted by an older fan base who are now dying off. You can win as much as you want now in the regular season and it doent matter. You have to win three in a row in March. The only way to elevate the basketball program is by getting into the MWC. That league is capable of getting three bids. If you win 27 games in the MWC you're going to the tourney. Football has to improve to get us into a better conference. If not basketball will be permanently stuck in mid/low major purgatory. You cant build a consistent winner in a one bid league and attendance will continue to slide.
Now that’s a beautiful example of doing more with less.
In 2012 the Ohio basketball team won 27 games with a trip to the sweet 16. Their hc Groce was paid a base salary of 250k.
That same year that football team won 9 games and the independence bowl. The hc made a base salary of 572k
For comparison sake in 2012 our basketball HC made a base salary of 600k and our newly hired football hc agreed to a base salary of 280k.
How much you want to bet that we averaged more fans than them in both sports that season too?
I agree it's sad the current situation of College Basketball. I hate seeing 16-14 power confidence schools over 25+ win mid majors. However I guess you're right the only answer would be if we got into Mountain West or AAC. To your point that only happens with a winning football team and basketball team over the next 3-5 years. I would love for the Football team to win. I'm just so used to them losing, I just don't believe it's possible. I hope I'm wrong, cause I'd love for them to prove otherwise. Let's win 4 games this year and jump up to 6 or 7 next year and at least show life!
It just goes to show, same amount of money, different priorities, different results.
Ohio U averaged 6,177
UTEP averaged 7,341 in basketball
Ohio U averaged 21,844
UTEP averaged 29,374 in football.
UTEP averaged 7,341 in basketball
Ohio U averaged 21,844
UTEP averaged 29,374 in football.
Ohio's coach Solich used to be the head coach at Nebraska. (They fired him for "only" winning 9 games a season.) Most G5 teams don't have an ex-Nebraska head coach, especially with the pedigree of Solich.
I would love to have hired Bo Pelini and I remember making a thread about that during the search for the new coach. I'm guessing, though, that there are plenty of schools that would love to hire Pelini but he's happy doing what he's doing.
Instead of Kugler I would have been happy just hiring an ex HC. He didn’t even have to coach at a P5 school like Nebraska.
Here’s another example. In 2011 La tech hired up and coming Mike White for a base salary of 150k. A year later at the same exact time we were hiring Kugler La Tech went with a proven HC for football in Skip Holtz for 500k.
We went the complete opposite direction. The results speak for themselves.
The recipe is out there being successfully used by almost every G5 school. Invest in football and everything else will fit into place.
We’re paying our coaches 1.425 combined. A good proven football coach could have come here for 1 million a year. A hot assistant for 425k.
Yes Terry is a great hire and it looks like we will have success in year two instead of year three-four had we gone with a hot assistant. But our football program takes the hit.
Drive, energy, discipline and knowing how to win with what you have. In other words, the Don Haskins method.
One CUSA coach that left an indelible mark on me when UTEP came into the conference was Coach Kragthorpe. The players on the sideline were in the game, no one was sitting on the bench; just plain electric when he was at Tulsa. He was a no name assistant when names like Pellini, Sumlin and Fisher were the hottest assistants on the market at that time. His Louisville stint was a disaster but when he was at Tulsa they were conference contenders every year.
One CUSA coach that left an indelible mark on me when UTEP came into the conference was Coach Kragthorpe. The players on the sideline were in the game, no one was sitting on the bench; just plain electric when he was at Tulsa. He was a no name assistant when names like Pellini, Sumlin and Fisher were the hottest assistants on the market at that time. His Louisville stint was a disaster but when he was at Tulsa they were conference contenders every year.
[QUOTE="utep2step,
One CUSA coach that left an indelible mark on me when UTEP came into the conference was Coach Kragthorpe. The players on the sideline were in the game, no one was sitting on the bench; just plain electric when he was at Tulsa. He was a no name assistant when names like Pellini, Sumlin and Fisher were the hottest assistants on the market at that time. His Louisville stint was a disaster but when he was at Tulsa they were conference contenders every year.[/QUOTE]
Unfortunately MS derailed his coaching career.
One CUSA coach that left an indelible mark on me when UTEP came into the conference was Coach Kragthorpe. The players on the sideline were in the game, no one was sitting on the bench; just plain electric when he was at Tulsa. He was a no name assistant when names like Pellini, Sumlin and Fisher were the hottest assistants on the market at that time. His Louisville stint was a disaster but when he was at Tulsa they were conference contenders every year.[/QUOTE]
Unfortunately MS derailed his coaching career.
The good news is that UTEP updated their official site this week to now show that Hankins did not play.
Page 15 now no longer lists Hankins as playing in the So. Miss game:
https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.si...19/10/2/2019_09_28_UTEP_Season_Statistics.pdf
