Big 12 expansion looking imminent

[jdubb66]

Certainly conceivable that B12 will poach at least 1 team and probably 2 from AAC. Given the unlikely event that the AAC will take from MWC given the formers devaluation, would UTEP consider joining their former mates? Keep in mind that AAC is set to make at least triple per team in TV revenue than the new CUSA deal will permit.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoo...o-something-soon-or-else-seven-things-to-know

 

[USAFminersfan]

I doubt the AAC is interested in us.

 

[MistaBinks]

We need the MWC is to get poached. I don't think we are in the AAC's top 5 or 8.

 

[shyminer81]

Interesting. Hope it hurries up... Would love to see the Miners in the MWC!

 

[PURPLEFIRE]

Does anyone want us?

 

[UTEPMiners8106]

Does anyone want us?

I say the same thing.

 

[JCorona]

It's been brought up before but my question is this. Let's assume the big12 picks up two AAC teams. Then the AAC turns around and does a power move by luring away four MW teams. Boise St, Colorado St or Air Force, New Mexico and San Diego St.

Under those circumstances would we still want to join a depleted MW conference or stay put in C-USA?

 

[miner661]

It's been brought up before but my question is this. Let's assume the big12 picks up two AAC teams. Then the AAC turns around and does a power move by luring away four MW teams. Boise St, Colorado St or Air Force, New Mexico and San Diego St.

Under those circumstances would we still want to join a depleted MW conference or stay put in C-USA?

If this were to happen and if the MWC extended UTEP an invite and if UTEP were accept such an invite, then we'd be joining a conference comprised of: UNM or SDSU, Colorado St or Air Force, Wyoming, Utah St, San Jose St, UNLV, Fresno St, and Nevada. While some of the luster would be faded (not having BSU would stink), that to me is still more attractive than remaining in C-USA as we know it now. JMO

 

[JCorona]

If this were to happen and if the MWC extended UTEP an invite and if UTEP were accept such an invite, then we'd be joining a conference comprised of: UNM or SDSU, Colorado St or Air Force, Wyoming, Utah St, San Jose St, UNLV, Fresno St, and Nevada. While some of the luster would be faded (not having BSU would stink), that to me is still more attractive than remaining in C-USA as we know it now. JMO

I know we are playing the what if game but would you really prefer to be in a conference with
Fresno St
San Jose St
Hawaii
Nevada
UNLV
Utah St
Wyoming
Air Force or Colorado St
UTEP
NMSU

Over our current membership. That includes cities like San Antonio, Houston, North Dallas, Charlotte, Norfolk, Birmingham, and Miami.

In my opinion if the MW losses a Colorado school, UNM and San Diego there is nothing there for us.

 

[kickballpro]

Big 12 may go for BYU. If that happens the shakeup will be minimal.

 

[PURPLEFIRE]

How about we just cut the crap and go straight into the big 12! If Baylor and that crappy program could do it so could we!!

 

[Voice of the Mosquito]

B12 is not going to take a MWC school. BYU is doing good with their current independence they are not on the table either. The pick will come form the AAC. I wish Dodd would get some NEW material on this subject otherwise this is just a rehash of his last 20 articles on this topic. The B12 will expand sometime in the future but I have seen nothing new to this scenario for the last two years or so.

 

[UTEPMiners8106]

Really? Youncant even begin to compare the two schools. The Dean of Baylor would jump out a window if he woke up with UTEP's money.

 

[utep2step]

How about we just cut the crap and go straight into the big 12! If Baylor and that crappy program could do it so could we!!

UTEP now offers Tier 1 research which is a big deal for conferences like that and Natalicio has transformed UTEP totally. Now if the major revenue sports would follow along, then yes...why not?

 

[Minerinciter]

If, by the way, the American Athletic Conference gets picked over by the Big 12, it could be good news for Marshall. If the AAC loses two teams, it could simply drop from 12 to 10 and stay put. But, if not, it will look for good football. And MU has the best football currently available. Thundering Herd AD Mike Hamrick might want to start making calls. - See more at: http://www.wvgazettemail.com/article/20160308/GZ02/160309501#sthash.pEn3brpF.dpuf

 

[TrojanMiner]

UTEP has less than a 0% chance of getting into the B12. Lol. They'd probably pay US to stay away!

 

[66miners]

We need the MWC is to get poached. I don't think we are in the AAC's top 5 or 8.

CSU could be a candidate. They'll be breaking ground on a on-campus football stadium at the end of this season. Ft Collins is a much more desirable destination than say Ames, IA or Lubbock, Tx.

 

[LaserCoog]

UTEP now offers Tier 1 research...

Link?

 

[LaserCoog]

Big 12 requires 8 of its 10 institutions to approve expansion, obviously a high bar. In reality, you only need one vote for approval...

Key to B12 future competitiveness in the financial arms race is its ability to construct a television network in the mold of the SEC and B10 networks. The LHN presents huge issues in that regard, but issues that can be resolved if the conference thinks big-time and long-term (10 - 20 years). Texas does NOT want UH (Boren at OU does), but many believe a B12 Network will not work without adding UH and solidifying the Houston TV market (and no, UConn will not consistently deliver the New York market). The extreme animus between Texas and UH continues, even after the departure of Deloss Dodds. X factor? Do not presume you're dealing with a complete battery of rational B12 actors here...

 

[jdubb66]

B12 can't make up the $20 Mil difference but Texas and Oklahoma can. I think its more likely that both those schools leave B12 and then, yes, UTEP can dream about being the the B12. But dream only.

 

[PURPLEFIRE]

I hoe everyone realizes I was being sarcastic lol

 

[unihorn]

Big 12 requires 8 of its 10 institutions to approve expansion, obviously a high bar. In reality, you only need one vote for approval...

Key to B12 future competitiveness in the financial arms race is its ability to construct a television network in the mold of the SEC and B10 networks. The LHN presents huge issues in that regard, but issues that can be resolved if the conference thinks big-time and long-term (10 - 20 years). Texas does NOT want UH (Boren at OU does), but many believe a B12 Network will not work without adding UH and solidifying the Houston TV market (and no, UConn will not consistently deliver the New York market). The extreme animus between Texas and UH continues, even after the departure of Deloss Dodds. X factor? Do not presume you're dealing with a complete battery of rational B12 actors here...

UCONN doesn't deliver the NY market, nor does UH deliver the Houston market.

 

[Voice of the Mosquito]

I think the stall by the B12 is the simple fact that there is not a viable school to invite. Every school left in the MWC and AAC comes with a lot of baggage and not a lot of benefit. We can talk about records, new stadiums, investment in program etc. but when these are compared to what the B12 has with it's existing members it falls short. Perception is the deal breaker here, The B12 needs it's perception to remain large state universities or well heeled privates who will break the bank to keep up. I don't mean just paying your coach 6 figures or building a stadium but spending at a level that will be sustained for the long term. I don't see any MWC or AAC in this zone and certainly not UTEP.

 

[LaserCoog]

UCONN doesn't deliver the NY market, nor does UH deliver the Houston market.

My post said the addition of UH would "solidify" - not "deliver" - the Houston market for the Big 12. And it would. Nobody - not Texas, not AnM, not LSU - delivers the Houston market. But anyone who knows today's Houston media market - soon to be the third largest city in the United States - understands that this is not the UH many orangbloods remember.

 

[Tribalwarriorx]

This is a big "if" proposition we're talking about. However, the Big 12 isn't an if - it's a when. When the B12 expands, the more likely spot they'll yank from will be the AAC. The AAC will respond in kind and make offers to other mid level conferences which will be the MWC. There are schools within that conference besides UNLV that are not happy with the current MWC revenue sharing agreement. If the AAC pulls teams from the MWC, no matter who it is, the MWC will HAVE to find two more teams to fill the void. In understanding that, we all know (or should) BYU isn't about to give up their independent status. They make way too much money on their own to give that up. The most likely spot for the MWC to pull from will be CUSA. Trust me, they're not pulling Idaho or anyone else from the Sun Belt. Now the question becomes who? The pro in UTEP's favor is the Sun Bowl. The con is a lack of fan support and "Ws." But fan support can be linked to the Ws. More wins, generally means more fans. Even if that wasn't the case, a schedule with the likes of other MWC schools is far more attractive than the current CUSA list. But if you're the MWC, is UTEP more attractive than Marshall or the current hot button, Western Kentucky?

The wildcard in all of this is the MAC conference. Would the MWC opt to pull two teams from there? There's only two heavy hitters in that conference Northern Illinois and Bowling Green. IMO, neither are an attractive option for the MWC.

 

[Tribalwarriorx]

My post said the addition of UH would "solidify" - not "deliver" - the Houston market for the Big 12. And it would. Nobody - not Texas, not AnM, not LSU - delivers the Houston market. But anyone who knows today's Houston media market - soon to be the third largest city in the United States - understands that this is not the UH many orangbloods remember.

You hit the nail on the head on this one.

 

[Tribalwarriorx]

I think the stall by the B12 is the simple fact that there is not a viable school to invite. Every school left in the MWC and AAC comes with a lot of baggage and not a lot of benefit. We can talk about records, new stadiums, investment in program etc. but when these are compared to what the B12 has with it's existing members it falls short. Perception is the deal breaker here, The B12 needs it's perception to remain large state universities or well heeled privates who will break the bank to keep up. I don't mean just paying your coach 6 figures or building a stadium but spending at a level that will be sustained for the long term. I don't see any MWC or AAC in this zone and certainly not UTEP.

UTEP isn't anytime soon getting an invite to the B12, for all of the reasons you said. However, there are options for the B12. Consider, Boise passed on joining the Pac12 because they knew they would be the big fish in the MWC. And they have been. They get the lions share of the revenue and are the most high profile university in the MWC's stable. In Boise's favor are they have strong community support, frequently field competitive teams and are a national brand. That makes them viable on one side. The down side for Boise is it's considered a small school with around 22-23k students (dunno how that is because Baylor only averages around 16k). Boise, because of their geographic location, would be a cost effective addition. The even bigger bonus is their fan base travels well.

Adding Houston, IMO, would be smart move for the B12. It's a big school, enrollment wise, sitting at around 33k (undergraduates). The only question is fan support. I think Herman has "sold" the program back to the community with the season they've add. No, they didn't sell out every game, but a schedule with some heavy hitters only helps.

BTW, every school, unless they just started their program has baggage. The perception of a benefit is in the eye of the beholder. In the B12's case, the question is what are they looking for in an expansion partner? I'd think a competitive program with strong community support would be important. The B12's problem is they have to expand because a lack of a conference championship is going to continue to be held against them - and they slept through the prior expansion of conferences either via arrogance or a lack of interest. Unfortunately, they don't have a lot of options here. Like the presidential race, when you wipe away the 30 second sound bites, there are no ideal candidates.

 

[MinerInWisconsin]

I know we are playing the what if game but would you really prefer to be in a conference with
Fresno St
San Jose St
Hawaii
Nevada
UNLV
Utah St
Wyoming
Air Force or Colorado St
UTEP
NMSU

Over our current membership. That includes cities like San Antonio, Houston, North Dallas, Charlotte, Norfolk, Birmingham, and Miami.

In my opinion if the MW losses a Colorado school, UNM and San Diego there is nothing there for us.

Ok, some more what ifs even though it's unlikely to happen.

If the MWC lost fo

This is a big "if" proposition we're talking about. However, the Big 12 isn't an if - it's a when. When the B12 expands, the more likely spot they'll yank from will be the AAC. The AAC will respond in kind and make offers to other mid level conferences which will be the MWC. There are schools within that conference besides UNLV that are not happy with the current MWC revenue sharing agreement. If the AAC pulls teams from the MWC, no matter who it is, the MWC will HAVE to find two more teams to fill the void. In understanding that, we all know (or should) BYU isn't about to give up their independent status. They make way too much money on their own to give that up. The most likely spot for the MWC to pull from will be CUSA. Trust me, they're not pulling Idaho or anyone else from the Sun Belt. Now the question becomes who? The pro in UTEP's favor is the Sun Bowl. The con is a lack of fan support and "Ws." But fan support can be linked to the Ws. More wins, generally means more fans. Even if that wasn't the case, a schedule with the likes of other MWC schools is far more attractive than the current CUSA list. But if you're the MWC, is UTEP more attractive than Marshall or the current hot button, Western Kentucky?

The wildcard in all of this is the MAC conference. Would the MWC opt to pull two teams from there? There's only two heavy hitters in that conference Northern Illinois and Bowling Green. IMO, neither are an attractive option for the MWC.

I'm suffering from the flu right now so please forgive me if I totally misconstrued what you wrote. Did you say the MWC could invite a team like Marshall? Or a team from the MAC? If that happens I will gladly jump from a tall building without a parachute. If the MWC needs 2 teams they will pick from the Texas schools and possible Wichita St since they have very good basketball and are talking about bringing back football. My money would be on UTEP and Rice but there is no certainty there. I do agree that Idaho would not be one of the schools invited.

 

[unihorn]

My post said the addition of UH would "solidify" - not "deliver" - the Houston market for the Big 12. And it would. Nobody - not Texas, not AnM, not LSU - delivers the Houston market. But anyone who knows today's Houston media market - soon to be the third largest city in the United States - understands that this is not the UH many orangbloods remember.

Of course Houston is a powerhouse media market and recruiting ground. And yes, UH is on a roll in football. Those two facts don't triangulate into a rationale for adding UH to the B12, however.

 

[Vegasminer]

What everyone forgets or is not aware of is this: Brand matters. And size matters. If Houston were to upgrade to the B12 their brand would exponentially grow and so would interest and fan support. A schools brand is part perception, part accomplishment but mostly conference affiliation (see Baylor). As far as size, it's not the student count but the potential number of TV sets that matter. Houston has millions. UTEP's Demo is growing and if somehow we could count Las Cruces, Ft Bliss and Juarez, we would be a powerhouse compared to anyone in the MWC.

 

[Minerforlife]

What everyone forgets or is not aware of is this: Brand matters. And size matters. If Houston were to upgrade to the B12 their brand would exponentially grow and so would interest and fan support. A schools brand is part perception, part accomplishment but mostly conference affiliation (see Baylor). As far as size, it's not the student count but the potential number of TV sets that matter. Houston has millions. UTEP's Demo is growing and if somehow we could count Las Cruces, Ft Bliss and Juarez, we would be a powerhouse compared to anyone in the MWC.

UTEP's demo and fanbase is already equal to any school in the MWC. Our problems are mostly internal.

 

[kickballpro]

The Dallas Morning News recently had a poll about the expansion candidates, here are the results.

Memphis 29.37 %
Boise State 13.74 %
Cincinnati 11.37 %
BYU 9.89 %
Northern Illinois 7.79 %
East Carolina 6.81 %
Colorado State 5.83 %
Florida State 3.71 %
SMU 3.1 6%
UConn 2.85 %
South Florida 2.8 %
Houston 2.68 %

The same poll taken in Utah

BYU 55.25 %
Memphis 13.51 %
Cincinnati 9.2 %
Colorado State 5.26 %
Boise State 5.07 %
Houston 3.52 %
Florida State 3.05%
South Florida 2.11 %
UConn 1.92 %
East Carolina 1.02 %
SMU 0.75%
Northern Illinois 0.33 %

 

[jdubb66]

UTEP isn't anytime soon getting an invite to the B12, for all of the reasons you said. However, there are options for the B12. Consider, Boise passed on joining the Pac12 because they knew they would be the big fish in the MWC. And they have been. They get the lions share of the revenue and are the most high profile university in the MWC's stable. In Boise's favor are they have strong community support, frequently field competitive teams and are a national brand. That makes them viable on one side. The down side for Boise is it's considered a small school with around 22-23k students (dunno how that is because Baylor only averages around 16k). Boise, because of their geographic location, would be a cost effective addition. The even bigger bonus is their fan base travels well.

Adding Houston, IMO, would be smart move for the B12. It's a big school, enrollment wise, sitting at around 33k (undergraduates). The only question is fan support. I think Herman has "sold" the program back to the community with the season they've add. No, they didn't sell out every game, but a schedule with some heavy hitters only helps.

BTW, every school, unless they just started their program has baggage. The perception of a benefit is in the eye of the beholder. In the B12's case, the question is what are they looking for in an expansion partner? I'd think a competitive program with strong community support would be important. The B12's problem is they have to expand because a lack of a conference championship is going to continue to be held against them - and they slept through the prior expansion of conferences either via arrogance or a lack of interest. Unfortunately, they don't have a lot of options here. Like the presidential race, when you wipe away the 30 second sound bites, there are no ideal candidates.

Boise didn't pass on joining the PAC12. That is the most asinine comment I've seen on this board and I've seen a few.

 

[Tribalwarriorx]

Boise didn't pass on joining the PAC12. That is the most asinine comment I've seen on this board and I've seen a few.

Yes they did. Larry Scott had a list of several schools that included Boise St. The conversations never grew past informal because Utah expressed more of an active interest. Hence why I said "passed." You may think it's asinine, but obviously you didn't know. Even more if that's the most asinine comment you've read on this board, you don't get out much.

So rather than offer a different version, as you understand, you just do your Donald Trump pout and stomp, right? Your response IS the most immature response I've read on these boards and I've read a few. This board is for adults. If you have nothing to add to a conversation other than pouting and stomping your foot, with a waggle of your finger and an angry scowl, move along buddy. SI.com is open to everyone.

And just so we're clear, that information came from as close as you can get. You know different?

 

[Tribalwarriorx]

Ok, some more what ifs even though it's unlikely to happen.

If the MWC lost fo


I'm suffering from the flu right now so please forgive me if I totally misconstrued what you wrote. Did you say the MWC could invite a team like Marshall? Or a team from the MAC? If that happens I will gladly jump from a tall building without a parachute. If the MWC needs 2 teams they will pick from the Texas schools and possible Wichita St since they have very good basketball and are talking about bringing back football. My money would be on UTEP and Rice but there is no certainty there. I do agree that Idaho would not be one of the schools invited.

This is all what if's. I said the MW has options and who would be likely candidates to replace a loss of Boise and another program. I said UTEP would be the most likely because of the Sun Bowl. I said would (and maybe I didn't post it that way) Marshall and Western K be more attractive to the MW. I also said I didn't think so. I've long maintained that Rice would be a good fit, but frankly I don't see the MW pitching two tents in Texas. As for the MAC, you never know for certain what a conference considers valuable and that NI could be a candidate as well as BG although both were unlikely. Get better. I had that and it had me down for several days.

 

[UTEPMiners8106]

Why would anyone think we would have a chance to go to the Big 12? We're always left behind during conference realignment, and our TV revenue is dropping. I just hope we're not left high and dry like NMSU down the road.

 

[LaserCoog]

Of course Houston is a powerhouse media market and recruiting ground. And yes, UH is on a roll in football. Those two facts don't triangulate into a rationale for adding UH to the B12, however.

C'mon horn you're just pissed because the ratings of UH's Peach Bowl victory over Florida State last year were greater than - help me out here - the bowl game that the Longhorns appeared in last year. And the year before that. And the year before that...

Such a typically arrogant, dismissive response from anybody with "horn" in their handle. You think Houston is a flash in the pan? Remember Briles? Sumlin? And tell me you wouldn't trade Charlie Strong for Tom Herman tomorrow. Go ahead, tell me...

Carnegie Foundation-recognized Tier 1 Research University. 42,000 total students. 300 graduate and undergraduate degree programs. Professional colleges in law, pharmacy, and ophthalmology. Located in the capital of the nation's energy and space programs. Faculty includes Nobel laureate and 11 National Academy members. Nationally competitive in men's and women's athletics, including football, basketball, baseball, and track and field. Located in one of the largest and most dynamic metropolitan and TV markets in the nation.

Nah, you're right, horn, non of that "triangulates" into a rationale for adding UH to the B12. After all, you've already got Waco, and Lubbock, and Lawrence, and Manhattan, and Aimes, right?

And you wonder why Arkansas, Colorado, Nebraska, Missouri, and Texas A$M jumped at the chance to get away from The University of Texas...

 

[unihorn]

C'mon horn you're just pissed because the ratings of UH's Peach Bowl victory over Florida State last year were greater than - help me out here - the bowl game that the Longhorns appeared in last year. And the year before that. And the year before that...

Such a typically arrogant, dismissive response from anybody with "horn" in their handle. You think Houston is a flash in the pan? Remember Briles? Sumlin? And tell me you wouldn't trade Charlie Strong for Tom Herman tomorrow. Go ahead, tell me...

Carnegie Foundation-recognized Tier 1 Research University. 42,000 total students. 300 graduate and undergraduate degree programs. Professional colleges in law, pharmacy, and ophthalmology. Located in the capital of the nation's energy and space programs. Faculty includes Nobel laureate and 11 National Academy members. Nationally competitive in men's and women's athletics, including football, basketball, baseball, and track and field. Located in one of the largest and most dynamic metropolitan and TV markets in the nation.

Nah, you're right, horn, non of that "triangulates" into a rationale for adding UH to the B12. After all, you've already got Waco, and Lubbock, and Lawrence, and Manhattan, and Aimes, right?

And you wonder why Arkansas, Colorado, Nebraska, Missouri, and Texas A$M jumped at the chance to get away from The University of Texas...

I congratulate you on Herman's success. It's not up to me whether or not UH joins the B12. Time will tell...

 

[Voice of the Mosquito]

Boise Passed on the Pac12? Please, pure bull, Colorado and Utah both were questioned about their academics being up to Pac 12 standards when they joined, I can't imagine where Boise's would stand.

 

[JCorona]

Boise St is like a dumb buff jock. Very good player but is academically ineligible half the season.