Now he's after the Trolleys https://diario.mx/el-paso/definira-cabildo-futuro-del-tranvia-en-el-centro-20230410-2044113.html
Grossman wants to end the Trolleys
- Thread starter Sports Opinion
- Start date
Good. The trolleys are trash. Anyone with a brain has been against them since their announcement.
“For opponents of the streetcar, such as the art historian Max Grossman, the high cost of operation generates losses for the City.
“In 2022, each trip cost taxpayers approximately $44.62!” said Grossman, who is a professor at UTEP. "In contrast, the average trip for urban buses was 8.77 dollars, five times less."
He insisted that the state of Texas initially provided $97 million for the streetcar system, and it has hemorrhaged financially ever since.
“The $2.9 million annual subsidy comes from the City's half-cent sales tax earmarked for public transportation, and supports the operation of the system, including the salaries of 15 City employees,” he concluded.
“For opponents of the streetcar, such as the art historian Max Grossman, the high cost of operation generates losses for the City.
“In 2022, each trip cost taxpayers approximately $44.62!” said Grossman, who is a professor at UTEP. "In contrast, the average trip for urban buses was 8.77 dollars, five times less."
He insisted that the state of Texas initially provided $97 million for the streetcar system, and it has hemorrhaged financially ever since.
“The $2.9 million annual subsidy comes from the City's half-cent sales tax earmarked for public transportation, and supports the operation of the system, including the salaries of 15 City employees,” he concluded.
I no longer live in El Paso, so what happens to them does not affect me, but I'm old enough to remember the original incarnation of the trolleys when I was a kid. This was the early sixties. It seems the line was longer and went into Juarez. I read an article in the Times about the system a while back. It said shoppers used trolleys to go over and shop the businesses in Juarez. Seems that the system paid for itself at the time. But local El Paso businessmen got into a pissing match over it because it sent trade across the river. That's what ended it. I'm all in favor of the nostalgia factor of keeping trolleys going, but the reality is that the system should be either built up in a way that actually works and pays for itself or should be retired as an outdated thing of the past. Of course, I also remember alligators being at San Jacinto Park downtown. That's no longer a viable thing either. Such is progress. Oh well.
Why does anybody care what Grossman thinks about the trolleys?
I have to admit
I have to admit that back in the day the success of the trolleys consisted of going to Juarez and they were always packed with people coming across the border to shop in El Paso and or vice versa, but that is never coming back. However in my personal opinion I am a big fan of the trolleys and I think it gives a signature or distinction to El Paso that many cities don't have. I think they just need to find a way of making it more useful. Maybe they didn't design the best route.
So do we get rid of the buses too? They’re trash as well. Mass transit doesn’t make a profit for the city as well.
The trolleys only run in a certain part of the city. The buses run all over the city and might be some lower income people’s only way to transport themselves. It would be great if they were making tons of money, but how would someone living on the eastside get to their job in central and vice versa without a bus?
While nobody really should care what he thinks, he is the unofficial downtown lightning rod.
The only way for the trolleys to work, was to have them cross into J Town. Now they are just a waste of money and space.
Everyone in EP knew this but someone high up was going to make money off it. Just like everything in El Paso. If you grease the right palms anything can happen.
I use to know a “ gentleman “ who ran an adult nightclub, he would tell me all the time it was time to pay the bribes. They left the club alone, until he left and the new management wouldn’t pay. Club was out of business not long after.
Everyone in EP knew this but someone high up was going to make money off it. Just like everything in El Paso. If you grease the right palms anything can happen.
I use to know a “ gentleman “ who ran an adult nightclub, he would tell me all the time it was time to pay the bribes. They left the club alone, until he left and the new management wouldn’t pay. Club was out of business not long after.
For the trolleys to cross into J Town again, El Paso or Texas would have to pay for the infrastructure across the border because Juarez is bankrupt and has no money for such project, it has a debt that will be paid in full until the 2030's and Juarez is like 80 years way behind in other things that are need it badly. The state of Chihuahua is also sink in debt.
While I agree that the trolleys are a waste of money (we all knew it the day they were announced) who gives a crap what Grossman thinks. If he’s the moral compass of this city then God help us.
I know it was and is not possible. But that was the only way to have people use it.
Right now it is useless. Why run up and down Staton? Maybe Mesa, and for sure Montana.
The only people I would imagine it could have served would be some ladies from Juarez who needed to go clean someone’s house on Mesa.
It's incredible that the 1960's were far more civilized times for life on the border. When both cities should be way ahead of where they are right now, we seem to live in the apocalyptic times.
Imagine hitting up Kentucky Club while Sinatra, Reagan, or Jim Morrison were there!
The same one who is doing this decade long suit to stop the arena. Some local anthropologist
Not to mention they completely fvcked up Stanton and Oregon streets.
Well I don't consider the trolleys to have Stanton and Oregon fvcked up, in fact I'm a big fan of the trolleys.
Trolleys are worthless and a TOTAL waste of money. While I can't stand Grossman, he is right this time.
Traffic on Stanton and Oregon sucks. Roads suck too.
Traffic on Stanton and Oregon sucks. Roads suck too.
From Monday through Friday. I guess some of you have never been to Juarez to really get a clue of what fvcked up streets really are.
Similar threads
