OT: Hong Kong
- Thread starter FiliUTEP
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I haven't read much about it, but I believe Hong Kong changed a law allowing extradition of criminals to China and Taiwan? People are protesting/rioting against this.
Xi Jinping, Putin, Erdogan, Jong-un, Mugabe, Najib Razak, et al.....
They have one thing in common: Permanent rule, trying or tried to change governmental elections or their constitution for supposed greater economic freedom and security. You know what? They suck at it.
China promised them they could keep their freedoms when they took control. So much for that.
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Not necessarily *criminals*. The fear is that China could extradite people for political or other reasons. And we know mainland China doesn't really need any reasons to throw someone in prison.
Correct.. China wants unlimited extradition rights for citizens of Hong Kong including political dissidents. HK citizens see this as a way to limit rights of free speech and assembly which have been granted for 40+ years until official hand over to China ( this was the agreement HK made after the UK handed HK back to China in 2000's) Other factors include the police and official government offices being increasingly staffed and directed by allies and political supporters of China. Covert control of media, education and government service to support the political goals and objectives of China and eliminate the opposition viewpoints. I will spare you my political viewpoint, only to say that these are classic methods of how a government gains then maintains control over citizens. This can happen in any country and in every from of government, left, right, democracy or socialism. Been to HK many times (last time June this year) and have found it's people some of the most kindest in the world, I feel for them because I think they are in for a long and damaging struggle and no one will win this battle.
Look it up folks because this will be taught in history class with our great great grandchildren and beyond. Democracy is getting its ass kicked.....badly, due to (ultra) nationalism. They are emboldened, which is why they are doing what they are doing. WWI was started because a very small group of disgruntled (the cheesy name of the Black Hand) men who couldn't get any action, drunk, broke, uneducated and hateful nationalist decided killing King Ferdinand was a good idea. So our great great grandads went to war. It happened again and some jackasses in "brown shirts" were literally beating the crap out of anyone who expressed opposing views that were not in line with their sociopath paranoid leader. Once again, grandpa got off his tractor (a good chunk of America was still agrarian and many recruits were "from the farm" which is not so widely taught) so we can enjoy what we enjoy today. And now? Putin is saying "Hold my beer". He is getting his ilk in national offices in South America, eastern Europe, central asian countries and else where.
So its not just a bunch of millennials acting up?? It looks like its only young people aka males protesting.
Like most protests the cause is not just one issue, it is many. My friends told me that the common language of HK, cantonese was being replaced by mainland preferred mandarin in schools, official paperwork and government work despite what residents preferred. English which was widely used and understood and taught in public and private schools also demoted as a outside threat to freedom and culture. (sound familiar?). Newspapers and media outlets were covertly prohibited from printing anything anti-government and faced legal action when the refused to comply all done under the guise of protection of the culture, rights and freedoms of the people. The people of HK are well educated and politically astute they see and understand what is occurring and they are making sure that the rest of world can see it as well.
Once the Sino-British Joint Declaration was agreed upon by the United Kingdom and China, I would have gotten the F**K out of Hong Kong ASAP. Did anyone foolishly think China would recognize "one country, two systems" all the way through 2047?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-British_Joint_Declaration
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-British_Joint_Declaration
Except this time everyone has smart phones. And Hong Kong is, for the moment, outside of the "Great Firewall of China" so the PRC can't keep it secret.
No. Voice of the mosquito has it 100% right. Hong Kong used to be a British Colony and used to enjoy Western Civil Liberties. Hong Kong was returned to China with the condition that Hong Kong could keep it's way of life. China sees a an opportunity to break it's promise. The citizens of Hong Kong are fighting like hell to stay free.
What do you all think about Lebron's comments regarding Daryl Morey and China?
I think it's true that Lebron doesn't have to say anything. He can protect himself, his family, his investments/financial opportunities, the Lakers and the NBA. However, that being said he has decided to use his platform to be an ambassador against racism, for human rights, etc.
I think he blew his best opportunity to stand behind his previous comments and put his person and his money where his mouth is. Unfortunately, he stood down in the face of danger. In my mind, this could have really cemented his legacy. I don't blame him, but it's too bad.
I think it's true that Lebron doesn't have to say anything. He can protect himself, his family, his investments/financial opportunities, the Lakers and the NBA. However, that being said he has decided to use his platform to be an ambassador against racism, for human rights, etc.
I think he blew his best opportunity to stand behind his previous comments and put his person and his money where his mouth is. Unfortunately, he stood down in the face of danger. In my mind, this could have really cemented his legacy. I don't blame him, but it's too bad.
I don’t want to get into a word or sentence feud with Labron James, but I believe he wasn’t educated on the situation at hand, and he spoke.
Civil liberties are getting a serious butt whooping all over the globe and even in western Europe, not just in Hong Kong.
Constant, constant wars and conflicts since WWI have changed the world like no one could have imagined and have caused massive, massive migration around the globe from the end of WWI up to this very day (just look at your own family history) and after WWI unnatural national boundaries have been redrawn by the powerful few. Hence, you have what you have in Hong Kong.
"Civil liberties or personal freedoms are personal guarantees and freedoms that the government cannot abridge, either by law or by judicial interpretation, without due process..."-Wiki
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He didn't stand down . He stood up....for China. A very dissapointing moment.
It's scary China is now effectively able to modulate speech in America. They turned a retweet from a GM and turned it into a crisis.
In today’s world where what you say is put under such intense scrutiny, Lebron and many other athletes/celebrities portrayed themselves as defenders of the faith when speaking about about the social justices and political climate within The United States. And because of that many people were comparing these individuals to the great civil rights leaders of the past including Muhammad Ali. But people forget that a lot of those individuals were willing to pay for what they believed in, and many did with their lives. Now I’m not trying to say the NBA is weak, or Lebron caved to money but with social media everyone sees him and the league backpedaling and they’re going to catch flack.
Voice of the Mosquito: You seem very knowledgeable about what’s going on over there. Do you think there is a situation where the people of Hong Kong are able to keep their sovereignty or are they just delaying the inevitable? And do they think any foreign powers are willing to get involved and aid them in this fight?
So much for Bron being “woke”. His comments made him look like a fool and ignorant to boot. LeBron don’t care about those Asian folk unless they buy his shoes. He stood with China as to not endanger the Nike sweatshops making those shoes. Same thing with Apple, selling out the protestors and siding with mainland China.
Shame on the NBA, Nike, Apple. Democracy is on its deathbed.
Shame on the NBA, Nike, Apple. Democracy is on its deathbed.
It does show that all these celebrities/athletes, companies ultimately serve somebody. Push come to shove no one is willing to betray their master (ie money), which is ironic since NBA players were saying the term “owner” was derogatory and brought images of slavery. They all portray themselves as independent thinkers and their own mini corporations but in the end they not big enough to step out of line in a way.
Not to get super political here but it really shines a light on the level of clout China has.
Just scroll through the comments and James is getting hammered. Does this hurt his brand/bottom line?
No sadly it expands it. The truth is the NBA is financed by Chinese money. The NBA is far more popular in China than in the US. If James would have spoken up for Hong Kong all of his endorsements, jersey and shoe sales dry up in China forever. This whole episode has been sad for the entire NBA. They bowed to a dictators wishes and totally abandoned American values and principles. If the NBA would have spoke up they would have lost half their revenue and teams would have lost half there value overnight. Still it's sad they put money over human rights and principles.Adam Silver was the golden boy of American Sports commissioners. His reputation has been permanently damaged by the embarrassing episode.
The people of Hong Kong have little chance of ever being sovereign nation. They may be able to obtain some degree of autonomy from China in the short term. Hong Kong has alway been the window into China for the world and vise a versa. Trade ties, banking and insurance have driven Hong Kong and they run very deep into China. I'm sure China is dependent on much of what HK does and does not want to jeopardize its status. China also realizes that as it develops the special status HK has enjoyed will diminish. China if anything is patient and they will slowly alter the culture and the nature of HK until it is firmly in their grasp and much of this has already been changed. I wish their efforts to seek self government could result in a more positive outcome but I see little chance of that happening unless the world gets involved to a high degree.
