Campus shooting at UNC- Charlotte
- Thread starter Minerinciter
- Start date
No not fake news, this is the most bloodthirsty country since the start of the century, over 500,000 kills(the low-end estimate) since the "war on terror" most of them innocent people. Also, it has a masturbatory gun culture only rivaled by the world population of teenage boys.
The "gun control" people talk about won't fix this. Gun free zones are just stupid. It's like saying Texas is weed free. pppfft
The biggest problem are the mentally unstable that find a way to get guns. I wonder how it happens, but harder background checks won't catch people that have issues but have never seen a doctor. Taking ALL the guns away only sets us up for attacks from other countries.
Then there is Chicago where it's like a war zone. Anyone want to bet those folks have guns but no permits?
MOST of our issues are the parents. My dad put the fear of God in me. My friends parents did the same. I don't count as I am a old dude with a young boy, but our kids aren't shooting up the world. Our kids kids are a different story. I think the last generation felt we were treated too mean by adults (but we turned out great), so they went soft on their kids instilling no discipline and no fear of consequences. Talks need to be done at all levels of school. In all cities. In every school.
I'm by no means an expert on anything, but to fix this you have to start at the ground and work up. This has very little to do with guns or gun control. Kids need to be taught right from wrong.
It's a damn shame kids can't go to school and be kids. I visited a small NM town last week. They had a fence around the whole school and guards for entrance. WTF are we forced to do these days? My God...
This is a damn shame
The biggest problem are the mentally unstable that find a way to get guns. I wonder how it happens, but harder background checks won't catch people that have issues but have never seen a doctor. Taking ALL the guns away only sets us up for attacks from other countries.
Then there is Chicago where it's like a war zone. Anyone want to bet those folks have guns but no permits?
MOST of our issues are the parents. My dad put the fear of God in me. My friends parents did the same. I don't count as I am a old dude with a young boy, but our kids aren't shooting up the world. Our kids kids are a different story. I think the last generation felt we were treated too mean by adults (but we turned out great), so they went soft on their kids instilling no discipline and no fear of consequences. Talks need to be done at all levels of school. In all cities. In every school.
I'm by no means an expert on anything, but to fix this you have to start at the ground and work up. This has very little to do with guns or gun control. Kids need to be taught right from wrong.
It's a damn shame kids can't go to school and be kids. I visited a small NM town last week. They had a fence around the whole school and guards for entrance. WTF are we forced to do these days? My God...
This is a damn shame
Whoa, and here I thought Digs and Kyyote's was full of right wing nuttery?
1977 people. 1977. Gun culture in USA took a major, major hard turn. I grew up with guns and believe in the pre 1977 mantra of gun ownership. This is a sports sight and I will not go on.
What happened in 1977? I was a wee lad, any links I'd like to read about what your talking about.
Reggie Jackson hit 3 home runs in game 6 of the World Series but it was Linda Ronstadt that stole the show.
Cops are taught means, motive, opportunity. The means to do a mass shooting is just so much easier here in this country.
The culture wars taught conservatives that tiny, regulations and controls are the same as confiscation. That's a shame.
I like guns. Doesn't mean we cant have a few more rules about them. Right off the top of my head.
1) no fly means no gun. People on the no-fly list can get guns. I don't think that should happen.
2) No assault riffles for people under 21 unless they're military. This rule already exists for handguns.
3) More liability for sellers of weapons. The way bars get in trouble for selling alcohol. People should get in trouble for selling to a looney. Some you can't predict, but others definitely.
4) Liability for family of looney murderers. The Newton kid was clearly crazy, the mom was irresponsible for keeping guns in that house. Shooting with him. If your kid is off, it's better you don't have guns.
That's it for me. I think those 4 rules would eliminate 80% of mass murders.
The culture wars taught conservatives that tiny, regulations and controls are the same as confiscation. That's a shame.
I like guns. Doesn't mean we cant have a few more rules about them. Right off the top of my head.
1) no fly means no gun. People on the no-fly list can get guns. I don't think that should happen.
2) No assault riffles for people under 21 unless they're military. This rule already exists for handguns.
3) More liability for sellers of weapons. The way bars get in trouble for selling alcohol. People should get in trouble for selling to a looney. Some you can't predict, but others definitely.
4) Liability for family of looney murderers. The Newton kid was clearly crazy, the mom was irresponsible for keeping guns in that house. Shooting with him. If your kid is off, it's better you don't have guns.
That's it for me. I think those 4 rules would eliminate 80% of mass murders.
You're right, but mass shootings are a new and consistent threat. Since Columbine.
1) no fly means no gun. People on the no-fly list can get guns. I don't think that should happen.
I don't know that any of the asshats that have done the mass shootings have been on the no fly list, BUT I would agree with this.
2) No assault riffles for people under 21 unless they're military. This rule already exists for handguns.
I think assault rifles shouldn't be allowed by ANY civilian. Seriously, who needs one?
3) More liability for sellers of weapons. The way bars get in trouble for selling alcohol. People should get in trouble for selling to a looney. Some you can't predict, but others definitely.
Slippery slope there. If the seller follows the laws, how can you fault him? Just like if a bar sells 2 shots to a person, but they are drinking a beer after leaving driving down the road and kill someone, is it REALLY the fault of the bar? Customers break the laws a lot more than sellers.
4) Liability for family of looney murderers. The Newton kid was clearly crazy, the mom was irresponsible for keeping guns in that house. Shooting with him. If your kid is off, it's better you don't have guns.
In MOST cases, I am totally with you on this one.
That's it for me. I think those 4 rules would eliminate 80% of mass murders.
Notice I didn't disagree much. I will on your last point. Changing your 4 ideas will in no way eliminate 80%. Hell, it might not eliminate any. But some changes do need to be made.
I don't know that any of the asshats that have done the mass shootings have been on the no fly list, BUT I would agree with this.
2) No assault riffles for people under 21 unless they're military. This rule already exists for handguns.
I think assault rifles shouldn't be allowed by ANY civilian. Seriously, who needs one?
3) More liability for sellers of weapons. The way bars get in trouble for selling alcohol. People should get in trouble for selling to a looney. Some you can't predict, but others definitely.
Slippery slope there. If the seller follows the laws, how can you fault him? Just like if a bar sells 2 shots to a person, but they are drinking a beer after leaving driving down the road and kill someone, is it REALLY the fault of the bar? Customers break the laws a lot more than sellers.
4) Liability for family of looney murderers. The Newton kid was clearly crazy, the mom was irresponsible for keeping guns in that house. Shooting with him. If your kid is off, it's better you don't have guns.
In MOST cases, I am totally with you on this one.
That's it for me. I think those 4 rules would eliminate 80% of mass murders.
Notice I didn't disagree much. I will on your last point. Changing your 4 ideas will in no way eliminate 80%. Hell, it might not eliminate any. But some changes do need to be made.
106 mass shootings THIS YEAR. And alot of the rules that were put in place were changed by this administration. Also we can talk about the mentally I'll all we want but every year funding for mental illness is cut. Every year mental institutions are closed. This country doesn't care about mental illness because we can't make money from it.
Convicted felons should not have any firearms. It's against federal and state law for a convicted felon to have a firearm unless the state restores other civil rights to the felon. Most states will not do that for a felon convicted of a violent crime.
"2) No assault riffles for people under 21 unless they're military. This rule already exists for handguns.
I think assault rifles shouldn't be allowed by ANY civilian. Seriously, who needs one?"
What's an assault rifle?
I think assault rifles shouldn't be allowed by ANY civilian. Seriously, who needs one?"
What's an assault rifle?
You know the ones made to look like military rifles that pathetic ammosexuals get off on owning so they can pretend they're badasses.
I get where you got your info, and it's accurate sort of.
The term "mass shooting" is commonly used for LARGE gatherings such as schools, bars, concerts, etc....not gang attacks in the hoods. A shooting at a house party in Chicago is by no means the same as the shooting at Charlotte. It's just not. The dude in Carolina "could have been" mentally ill. The dudes shootin up the hood are just gang rats doing what they do. Let's not confuse things here.
I won't argue your comments about the mentally ill since I don't have the facts. I will say this, don't believe everything media tells you, nor what politicians say. They ALL lie to help themselves.
You know the ones made to look like military rifles that pathetic ammosexuals get off on owning so they can pretend they're badasses.
According to military specs none of those are assault rifles, as they don't have select fire capability. They are small caliber, low powered rifles (lower power than standard deer hunting rifles) which use design elements which make them look like military weapons. This is one thing that's so annoying about debating gun control, the people who want to ban guns don't really define what they want to ban.
So what is it about these guns that should be banned?
Similarly, the defenders of guns want to get so technical, you can't ban or regulate any. If you say, any weapon that is rapid fire, the response is "well grenade launchers arent", so ban this gun, but that one, okay libtard". "If the response is anything that can Pierce standard police vests, the response is so that's most deer riffles, dumbocrat".
Okay, fine, I'll play your game. No one under 21 unless they're military should buy a gun that isn't a bolt action or a pump action. For me the problem is the ability to fire rapidly. I want indiscriminate shooters to have to load and aim. Not just rain a spray of bulllets into a crowd knowing they can fire hundreds of bullets rather quickly and hit quite a few people. That's it. My goal isn't lofty, I want mass shootings to result in just a few less deaths. Were the only country in the world that has these events and dreaming big is, imagine if the Vegas shooter killed only half?
How about limit magazines to 10 bullets? That would slow down the next gun nut.
Your first gun is free, more than that you need to insure and register them like a vehicle, that might limit the number of guns out there.
OK, I understand you, I think. Do you want to restrict semi-autos to people over 21? Also, we most certainly aren't the only country with mass shootings. The New Zealand mosque shooting wasn't long ago. Norway had one of the worst in history, and going back a few decades South Korea had a terrible one.
This is the only country where this happens on a weekly basis. Yeah this will happen like once or twice in most countries and then they solve the problem.
No other country would tolerate Columbine, Sandy Hook, Vegas, Orlando, and more and not take concrete actions to solve the problem. Take action.
What's the Conservative solution besides shitting on Democractic proposals? Or arguing that there's no problem?
Well for one, it's NOT happening on a weekly basis. One time is too many, but stop exaggerating.
Do you know for a fact other countries don't have the same problem but we just don't hear about it as much? You really don't know what goes on in other countries.
Look bro, no one has "concrete" solutions. Everyone's ideas are just that, ideas. If you feel the Republicans are at fault for not fixing this, then why is it democratic presidents were in charge in 3 of the 4 you listed and nothing was done to your satisfaction? I know I know.....congress was controlled by the republicans, therefore their fault cuz like, you know, the democrats have the answers.
Bottom line is this, there is no easy fix and screwing with the 2nd amendment is just not where we need to go. This isn't a political thing, IMHO.
The second amendment is more than likely where we need to go. The second amendment is why this happens so often. The problem is political.
Yes, we know this doesn't happen in other countries. Yes, we know this. Shit man, you said well this happened in Norway 15 years ago. Yeah 15 years ago. In South Korea before I was born probably. You're being obtuse for the sake of the argument.
Nah, I just don't agree with your position, or anyone that wants to touch the second amendment. Don't get me wrong, I don't own guns. My wife's side are hunters in New Mexico. I do have friends on both sides of the isle that have handguns for protection in their homes. Hell, with all the illegal people flooding our city, it may behoove me to reconsider getting a gun.
Don't believe what the media wants you to believe. They have an agenda. They never report what great things the police do in the communities, but get a bunch of asshole kids talking back to them on video, and the crap blows up.
You may believe it's political, and that's part of the problem, but it's a right and wrong issue. It's wrong to think you have the right to go to a school and shoot innocent people. It's wrong to take a gun away from me because some asshat did that in Carolina. It's wrong to blame this on conservatives just because you ride the liberal way. It's right to want to fix the problem. It's right to believe it has more to do with teaching kids at an early age. Oh and it's wrong to feel you have a need to own any automatic rifle. That's just stupid.
The HUGE difference here is I look at the issue from a non political angle. I don't give a crap who supports what. I just want the right thing done.
Don't believe what the media wants you to believe. They have an agenda. They never report what great things the police do in the communities, but get a bunch of asshole kids talking back to them on video, and the crap blows up.
You may believe it's political, and that's part of the problem, but it's a right and wrong issue. It's wrong to think you have the right to go to a school and shoot innocent people. It's wrong to take a gun away from me because some asshat did that in Carolina. It's wrong to blame this on conservatives just because you ride the liberal way. It's right to want to fix the problem. It's right to believe it has more to do with teaching kids at an early age. Oh and it's wrong to feel you have a need to own any automatic rifle. That's just stupid.
The HUGE difference here is I look at the issue from a non political angle. I don't give a crap who supports what. I just want the right thing done.
Okay. What's the right thing? Why are we the only country that has this recurring problem? How do we stop it. What are your ideas? If my ideas are bad. What are your ideas? My ideas are based off of the ideas of what other countries did after mass shootings. What are your ideas? Okay, don't touch guns. So, what would you do?
And to clarify my position. I am not in favor of removing the second amendment, confiscating guns. Just a few rules and limits. Responsible gun owners, I recognize are the majority. We just need to make mass casualties harder.
Like, if the Vegas shooter just had bolt action riffles. How many people does he kill? 10-20. Thats better than over 55 right?
If parents knew that they could go to jail (the same way dog owners go to jail if their dog kills someone) for negligence if their psycho son goes on a spree. Do parents maybe not buy their kids guns for their birthdays? Does Parkland or Columbine happen?
I forget the shooting, but there was a story of ONE gun store owner who wouldn't sale to the shooter because something seemed off. If every weapons dealer HAD to use discretion like that, do obvious psychos still amass their huge arsenals?
We make rules about all the amendments. Yes, you have free speech(1st amendment), but you can't make threats. Yes, you have privacy (4th amendment), but you can't get on that plane without a thorough search.
Okay, some rules, without taking away guns. Some rules, shoot, without banning any type of gun for people over 21. Just some rules. Like how cars have rules. That's all this very far to the left Democrat wants.
Like, if the Vegas shooter just had bolt action riffles. How many people does he kill? 10-20. Thats better than over 55 right?
If parents knew that they could go to jail (the same way dog owners go to jail if their dog kills someone) for negligence if their psycho son goes on a spree. Do parents maybe not buy their kids guns for their birthdays? Does Parkland or Columbine happen?
I forget the shooting, but there was a story of ONE gun store owner who wouldn't sale to the shooter because something seemed off. If every weapons dealer HAD to use discretion like that, do obvious psychos still amass their huge arsenals?
We make rules about all the amendments. Yes, you have free speech(1st amendment), but you can't make threats. Yes, you have privacy (4th amendment), but you can't get on that plane without a thorough search.
Okay, some rules, without taking away guns. Some rules, shoot, without banning any type of gun for people over 21. Just some rules. Like how cars have rules. That's all this very far to the left Democrat wants.
I guess you didn't read my posts. It's cool. This board isn't about debating gun laws anyway.
I'm done with this thread. Prayers to UNC Charlotte.
#picksup #backtosports
I'm done with this thread. Prayers to UNC Charlotte.
#picksup #backtosports
You're done because all you have is generalities, platitudes, and sentiments. Nothing to back up your thinking besides some talking points you heard on Conservative radio or Fox News. No solutions, no ideas, just don't touch my guns and maybe if God was still in school.
If you're going to use a straw man arguement. So will I.
I'm glad you're happy that school kids get shot, so that you could own the libs. Libs hate school shootings, so stopping school shootings is bad politics. Better to let Innocents die than lose an election or anger the gun lobby.
bait taken....
Look bruh, I do not watch Fox news, listen to conservative radio, or read republican trash. Apparently you follow everything hard core democrat and believe whatever they spoon feed you. That's cool if you want to live that way, but I choose to think on my own and not be told what to believe.
You see, I don't anything to back up what I THINK, because it's my OPINION. If you would look back at a post in which I replied to you, you would see I agree with most of your suggestions. Not my fault you go off half cocked and attack mode. Typical hard core democrat. (hard core repubs are no better.)
I'm sure you will attack once again, but I am done with this..for sure this time....ciao...
Sorry if I went too hard on you specifically.
I never start these damn political threads. I'd rather talk UTEP sports.
The Conservatives started making jokes about gun free zones.
And I stand behind my question "what would you do?"
If one side has a set of proposals and the other says no. What are the alternative proposals? I might support alternative solutions, but where are they?
I liked Joe Rogan's quote on this
"this country has a mental health problem disguised as a gun problem".
I've said this before and i'll say it again-- guns are only an "issue" because they are an easy political target for Democrats. Most all major gun lobbies are Conservative leaning, therefore guns and the NRA are regularly blamed for these attacks by the left.
Thing is, neither the NRA or the 2A have anything to do with this. Furthermore, none of the increased regulatory efforts we keep hearing about would have prevented these shootings.... so why are they regularly talked about as a fix?
Going back to the mental health side-- you know what isn't quite mentioned as much? pharmaceuticals.
Most of these mass killers are on SSRI's or similar mood stabilizers. Maybe we should be asking what exactly happens to SOME people (who already have mental issues) when they are put on medications that can literally impact and remove their sense of feeling and empathy. What happens when a severely depressed person loses that sense of empathy..... that little voice inside their head that prevents them from truly jumping off the deep end?
Know this-- the biggest, scariest lobby out there isn't the NRA.... it's big pharma... and they don't pick sides. Instead, they line the pockets of everyone with influence. This includes your favorite Republicans, Democrats, Cable News channel, local newspaper, etc....etc....
"this country has a mental health problem disguised as a gun problem".
I've said this before and i'll say it again-- guns are only an "issue" because they are an easy political target for Democrats. Most all major gun lobbies are Conservative leaning, therefore guns and the NRA are regularly blamed for these attacks by the left.
Thing is, neither the NRA or the 2A have anything to do with this. Furthermore, none of the increased regulatory efforts we keep hearing about would have prevented these shootings.... so why are they regularly talked about as a fix?
Going back to the mental health side-- you know what isn't quite mentioned as much? pharmaceuticals.
Most of these mass killers are on SSRI's or similar mood stabilizers. Maybe we should be asking what exactly happens to SOME people (who already have mental issues) when they are put on medications that can literally impact and remove their sense of feeling and empathy. What happens when a severely depressed person loses that sense of empathy..... that little voice inside their head that prevents them from truly jumping off the deep end?
Know this-- the biggest, scariest lobby out there isn't the NRA.... it's big pharma... and they don't pick sides. Instead, they line the pockets of everyone with influence. This includes your favorite Republicans, Democrats, Cable News channel, local newspaper, etc....etc....
Actually I mostly agree. And yup, Democrats take big money from big pharma too and that's a big part of the problem. There will always be people who are "off" and I think pumping them full of pills isn't the best solution. Maybe the quickest and most profitable, but not the best.
Tucson, Parkland, the Aurora shootings all have a mental health component to them and maybe a better mental health system would have prevented those.
But again, it's not like there are a lot of politicians, especially Republicans who are promoting more mental health. It boils back to that. Actually, i think it boils down to who has the best political lobbies. Unfortunately.
Dude...well put. I worked in the MH field, front lines, for 10 years. I’m no conspiracy theorist, but Big Pharma is an evil entity. Those with mental health issues are among their easiest targets. The drugs provided rarely help anyone, and in most cases exacerbate it. They keep a person numb enough, or just far enough removed from the problem, from an emotional standpoint, to actually work on it and heal from it. Worst case scenario, like you said, the remaining traces of human empathy are clouded over and once that occurs, anything can happen from there.
I’ll throw this out there first as an attempt at disarmament. I don’t claim any particular political party. Following my “inner compass”, I do however naturally lean more to the left, specifically when it comes to social issues. However, with that said, the dems are no closer to alleviating the MH crises than their counterparts. Perhaps more emphasis is placed upon the problem by the left, but trying to combat the issue by continuing to throw more of the same ineffective programming into the mix is just as damaging as not doing anything about it at all. Neither of the major political parties can claim, with any honesty, that they are truly trying to solve the crisis. The right seems to act as if there isn’t even a problem and the left seems to try to use it as evidence of compassion. Acting like there isn’t a problem and knowing there is one but not deviating from the norm and exploring effective means of treatment are equally damaging, imo. Therefore we need to move beyond this having anything to do with politics...if that is even possible at this point.
