MS 13 are Satanists.And dont some drug cartels worship some kind of demon? I know when they cross the desert they pray to some skeleton??
OT: El Paso Mass Shooting
- Thread starter JCorona
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MS 13 are Satanists.And dont some drug cartels worship some kind of demon? I know when they cross the desert they pray to some skeleton??
I think she's a product of Mexican folk religion. Some marginalized people who don't feel at home in the Catholic Church have turned to her, and in that sense I'm sure that the Catholic Church is happy to characterize this as demon-worship. As for Satanists using this figure, I wouldn't know, but I don't think most of her devotees are invoking her as the personification of Satan or even as a demon.
I think Mexican culture has a folk history with skeletons (Day of the Dead, etc.) and this is a figure somebody, inspired by this folk history, made up in the last hundred years and has really exploded in popularity in the last 20 years or so. I don't think this is a character in the pantheon of traditional Christian demonology. To me, it's a folk religion.
I'll chime in here. I just want a president with morals and values that reflect what I believe we've all grown up with. I, being Democrate, would have voted for Kasich over just about any dem in the last election. It's not Republicans who are the problem. The problem is the idiot in the White House.
Hate to derail this post.But since we on topic. So how do you think the earth was created?? Have you heard of that youtube channel the athiest experience?? Im Christian and i like to listen to it sometimes. They have some good debates there.
I would be happy with a President who is not a racist. And is not a misogynist. And is not xenophobic. And is not homophobic. And is not a pathological liar.
Said another way, I would be happy with a President who is a good, honest, hard working, really decent person (man or woman) who cares deeply about doing what's best for our country and for us -- our country's citizens. A President who understands that as President of the U.S.A., he or she has an enormous responsibility as the leader of the free world to fight for those who cannot fight for themselves; to offer a lending hand to those fleeing from oppression and violence; to work to preserve Mother Earth; after all, we have nowhere else to go.
The democratic party is far from perfect but we can hold our heads up knowing that we stand for what's right and what's good. There was a time -- really not that long ago -- when the republican party could make a similar claim. That is no longer the case.
Tяump's republican party is not your daddy's republican party. Tяump's republican party is a party of hate and division fueled by racism and bigotry. Anyone still supporting, enabling, and defending Tяump, McConnell, McCarthy, etc., is supporting, enabling, and defending racism and bigotry and everything ugly that is today's republican party. Anyone still claiming allegiance to today's republican party is claiming allegiance to all that is ugly and wrong in the world today.
Not all Republicans are racists, but the most racist people in the country are Republican. And the "Good" Republicans just let them be a part of their party. Steve Bannon, Steven Miller are avowed Racists and they worked in the White House. That Spencer Guy (forgetting his name) was telling "Hail Trump".
I know are most Republicans good people, but for the life of me I can't understand how PizzaGate, Q, Jade Helm, Sandy Hook Denials can be a part of a respectable party at all. And yet it is.
William Buckley, Father of Modern Day Conservatives, famously said he considered it his duty to run the nuts away from his movement. Unfortunately, since the 90s on, the Republicans have welcomed and elboldened the nuts.
To be fair, Democrats were the same as well. That is how the Democrats had a stranglehold of power from the 1930s to the 1970s. George Wallace, Huey Long, City Machines.
My theory is that there are really 3 Parties in the U.S. The Liberals, The Conservatives, and the Angry Nuts. The party in power is the party that includes the Angry Nuts. Right now, the Republicans have that coalition, but they've lost control of them and now they are the party. This ain't Reagan's, Bush, McCains party anymore. Not at all.
Republicans need to see that. It's sad they haven't. Their enabling behavior they themselves don't approve of. Like a spouse who doesn't approve of their partners drinking but is always there to pick up the pieces. That's the Republican Party.
"Not all Republicans are racists, but the most racist people in the country are Republican. And the "Good" Republicans just let them be a part of their party".
It was hard to read any further than this without shaking my head in frustration. This assumption is not even feasible without having a skewed mindset. Whoever believes this is guilty of the same thing that you think you are fighting against.
It was hard to read any further than this without shaking my head in frustration. This assumption is not even feasible without having a skewed mindset. Whoever believes this is guilty of the same thing that you think you are fighting against.
I agree 100% with this! I would also add to be fair and impartial to ALL races and religions.
Man, I don’t think you need to defend yourself any further, axing. You are obviously a level headed, open minded, non racist, non bigoted good guy who happens to identify as being a Republican. And there are many more like you. That I know without a doubt. I teach alongside people from all walks of life, probably 50% of them identifying as Republicans and many are what I consider to be good, caring, compassionate people. It’s unfortunate that the “black or white” mentality reigns supreme.
This coming from someone who leans far more to the left.
I will largely agree. I've said it a lot. Most Republicans are good people. There is a small minority of terrible people that have found safe harbor in the party. I wish they didn't have safe harbor in there. I'm frustrated they are allowed to be there. I wish they weren't there. The R next to their name makes them legitimate. Our Texas Lt. Governor is a crazy. Our Governor is not. I wish there weren't so many crazies in the party.
John McCain was more of a hero than nearly all of us. He was Conservative.
Thanks for saying that. I appreciate it. I will stop.
Will Hurd (R) represents one the most gerrymandered districts in the U.S., is republican and now is retiring. Right now he is doing his part to speak up for El Paso since a good chunk of it is in his district (the GOP mixed far west Texas blue with deep Medina county red in San Antonio). This, IMO, will be a big part of his legacy.....and I'm a lefty.....
"Rep. Hurd urged his colleagues Wednesday night to support this important bill. Hurd’s full remarks as prepared are below:
“I rise today in support of H.R. 759, the YsletaDdel Sur Pueblo and Alabama-Coushatta Tribes of Texas Equal and Fair Opportunity Settlement Act.
As a Representative with more tribes in their district than any other Texan, it is my solemn obligation to fight on behalf of Texas’ native people.
I am a proud Texan, there is no greater State in the Union, no prouder people than we Texans and for all the blessings bestowed upon the Lone Star state, we still fall short in our efforts of providing true economic stability to our Native American Tribes.
The Ysleta Del Sur Pueblo are the oldest community in the State of Texas, claiming a governing body since 1682. During the Texas Revolution it was the Alabama-Coushatta of East Texas who provided refuge, food and medicine to the great Sam Houston and his army. Their story is sown into the fabric of Texas’ history.
H.R. 759 is not about whether one agrees or disagrees with gambling. This bill isn’t about gambling. It’s about letting two tribes in two of Texas’ most economically distressed zones engage in what every other tribe in America engages in....."
The Texas GOP has battled the Tiguas and Alabama-Coushatta for decades over gambling. He took the facts, history and the fight to his own party in Texas.
https://elpasoheraldpost.com/bill-t...-tribe-to-legally-operate-bingo-passes-house/
"Rep. Hurd urged his colleagues Wednesday night to support this important bill. Hurd’s full remarks as prepared are below:
“I rise today in support of H.R. 759, the YsletaDdel Sur Pueblo and Alabama-Coushatta Tribes of Texas Equal and Fair Opportunity Settlement Act.
As a Representative with more tribes in their district than any other Texan, it is my solemn obligation to fight on behalf of Texas’ native people.
I am a proud Texan, there is no greater State in the Union, no prouder people than we Texans and for all the blessings bestowed upon the Lone Star state, we still fall short in our efforts of providing true economic stability to our Native American Tribes.
The Ysleta Del Sur Pueblo are the oldest community in the State of Texas, claiming a governing body since 1682. During the Texas Revolution it was the Alabama-Coushatta of East Texas who provided refuge, food and medicine to the great Sam Houston and his army. Their story is sown into the fabric of Texas’ history.
H.R. 759 is not about whether one agrees or disagrees with gambling. This bill isn’t about gambling. It’s about letting two tribes in two of Texas’ most economically distressed zones engage in what every other tribe in America engages in....."
The Texas GOP has battled the Tiguas and Alabama-Coushatta for decades over gambling. He took the facts, history and the fight to his own party in Texas.
https://elpasoheraldpost.com/bill-t...-tribe-to-legally-operate-bingo-passes-house/
If ive been a jerk on this thread id like to apologize. It's hard to explain, but as a first generation American I deeply fell in love with this country.
I sincerely believed MLKs quote about the slow bending arc of history and believed we were making progress. I always knew there was a dark side, but I thought it was small and contained.
Then Trump came, made his first speech about my community and I was shocked he won the primary. Shocked no one ran third party. Shocked as everything has degenerated into this.
Then my community was attacked. Attacked by an outsider who was attacking what I thought made this place beautiful.
It's just a bummer of a time. Plus UTEP Athletics sucks to make everything worse lol.
I sincerely believed MLKs quote about the slow bending arc of history and believed we were making progress. I always knew there was a dark side, but I thought it was small and contained.
Then Trump came, made his first speech about my community and I was shocked he won the primary. Shocked no one ran third party. Shocked as everything has degenerated into this.
Then my community was attacked. Attacked by an outsider who was attacking what I thought made this place beautiful.
It's just a bummer of a time. Plus UTEP Athletics sucks to make everything worse lol.
Since I live roughly one mile from that Walmart I have to pass it every single day more than once. I see the cars that were left over in the parking lot are finally gone for the most part. I see a bunch of satellites trucks another vehicles in the Sam's parking lot still. I wonder how long it will be until the Sam's and Walmart are open again. I know some people will have a lot of trouble going there without feeling unnerved.
That's data not opinion. I'm not even going to get into why the graph shoots up like that at 2016.
One shooting is way too many but this graph is a little deceptive in that the vast majority in this spike is one incident: Las Vegas:
Here are the top 10 worst shootings in US history:
1 Las Vegas shooting 2017 58 (plus 1 perp.) 851 (422 from gunfire) Semi-automatic rifles and revolver [65][66]
2 Orlando nightclub shooting
3 Virginia Tech shooting
4 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting 2012 27 (plus 1 perp.) 2 Semi-automatic rifle and pistol [65]
5 Sutherland Springs church shooting 2017 26 (plus 1 perp.)[fn 1] 20 Semi-automatic rifle [67][66]
6 Luby's shooting
7 El Paso shooting 2019 22 24 Semi-automatic rifle [68][69]
8 San Ysidro McDonald's massacre
9 Stoneman Douglas High School shooting 2018 17 17 Semi-automatic rifle [70]
10 University of Texas tower shooting
Studies also show that the frequency rate tripled between 2011 and 2015. In 2015 we hit about one mass shooting per day in this country (mainly domestic violence). As of August 9, 2019 we have had 251 mass shootings in 216 days (mainly domestic violence).
Also according to the conservative New York Times: "According to The New York Times, the majority of perpetrators they have published stories about are white males who act alone.[40] According to most analyses and studies however, the proportion of mass shooters in the United States who are white is not considerably greater than the proportion of white people in the general population of the US.[41]"
I have said this before and I'll say it again, this isn't a Trump or racist problem as much as America has been losing it's sense of right and wrong for decades now. We are losing our soul.
Maybe, but maybe no high capacity magazines ? Let'sgo back to muskets be or something.if were gonna have mass shootings or attacks I'd rather have 5 dead than 20.One shooting is way too many but this graph is a little deceptive in that the vast majority in this spike is one incident: Las Vegas:
Here are the top 10 worst shootings in US history:
1 Las Vegas shooting 2017 58 (plus 1 perp.) 851 (422 from gunfire) Semi-automatic rifles and revolver [65][66]
2 Orlando nightclub shooting2016 49 (plus 1 perp.) 53 Semi-automatic rifle and pistol [65][66]
3 Virginia Tech shooting2007 32 (plus 1 perp.) 23 (17 from gunfire) Semi-automatic pistols [65]
4 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting 2012 27 (plus 1 perp.) 2 Semi-automatic rifle and pistol [65]
5 Sutherland Springs church shooting 2017 26 (plus 1 perp.)[fn 1] 20 Semi-automatic rifle [67][66]
6 Luby's shooting1991 23 (plus 1 perp.) 27 Semi-automatic pistols [65]
7 El Paso shooting 2019 22 24 Semi-automatic rifle [68][69]
8 San Ysidro McDonald's massacre1984 21 (plus 1 perp.) 19 Semi-automatic carbine, pistols, and shotgun [65]
9 Stoneman Douglas High School shooting 2018 17 17 Semi-automatic rifle [70]
10 University of Texas tower shooting1966 16 (plus 1 perp. plus 1 victim who died in 2001[fn 1] 31 Rifles, revolver, pistols, and shotgun [65]
Studies also show that the frequency rate tripled between 2011 and 2015. In 2015 we hit about one mass shooting per day in this country (mainly domestic violence). As of August 9, 2019 we have had 251 mass shootings in 216 days (mainly domestic violence).
Also according to the conservative New York Times: "According to The New York Times, the majority of perpetrators they have published stories about are white males who act alone.[40] According to most analyses and studies however, the proportion of mass shooters in the United States who are white is not considerably greater than the proportion of white people in the general population of the US.[41]"
I have said this before and I'll say it again, this isn't a Trump or racist problem as much as America has been losing it's sense of right and wrong for decades now. We are losing our soul.
I won't argue your point about us as a nation losing our soul. However, giving Tяump and his racist cultists a pass on all of this violence is simply wrong. Tяump has used his platform from day 1 of his candidacy to attack Mexicans and other hispanics.
From. Day. One.
I remember Jobu reflecting on Tяump's announcement for president awhile back. He posted that on that day he thought, and I'll paraphrase here, "Well, there came and went his presidential candidacy" as Tяump opened his sewer and called all Mexicans rapists and drug dealers. Make no mistake, he was not then and never will be sincere about "and I assume, some, are good people."
And yet, here we are.
To defend Tяump is to defend racism and every other ugly thing he espouses. And defending all of that ugliness is also supporting and enabling it. And to do that, well, paints every person doing that as ... more than complicit. It paints every one of those people as a racist. As a bigot. As everything that Tяump is.
That cannot be outrun. If you defend, support, and enable Tяump and his hatred, you need to own it.
Top El Paso Trump donors in 2019 per FEC
STIPE, BEVERLY TX RETIRED 02/08/2019 $2,800.00
HATCH, BETHANY TX THE PET BARRACKS 02/08/2019 $2,800.00
CARDWELL, JIM TX C&R DISTRIBUTING 02/08/2019 $2,800.00
CARDWELL, JIM TX C&R DISTRIBUTING 02/08/2019 $2,800.00
BOWLING, ROBERT TX TROPICANA BUILDING CORPORATED 02/13/2019 $2,800.00
BOWLING, ROBERT TX TROPICANA BUILDING CORPORATED 02/13/2019 $2,800.00
STIPE, BEVERLY TX RETIRED 02/08/2019 $2,800.00
HATCH, BETHANY TX THE PET BARRACKS 02/08/2019 $2,800.00
CARDWELL, JIM TX C&R DISTRIBUTING 02/08/2019 $2,800.00
CARDWELL, JIM TX C&R DISTRIBUTING 02/08/2019 $2,800.00
BOWLING, ROBERT TX TROPICANA BUILDING CORPORATED 02/13/2019 $2,800.00
BOWLING, ROBERT TX TROPICANA BUILDING CORPORATED 02/13/2019 $2,800.00
I don't think Americans are the worst people in the world or have the worst outliers even. We just have the worst laws. Most gun owners and NRA members even are okay with some gun reform. However, the NRA organization itself isn't and no one will cross them.One shooting is way too many but this graph is a little deceptive in that the vast majority in this spike is one incident: Las Vegas:
Here are the top 10 worst shootings in US history:
1 Las Vegas shooting 2017 58 (plus 1 perp.) 851 (422 from gunfire) Semi-automatic rifles and revolver [65][66]
2 Orlando nightclub shooting2016 49 (plus 1 perp.) 53 Semi-automatic rifle and pistol [65][66]
3 Virginia Tech shooting2007 32 (plus 1 perp.) 23 (17 from gunfire) Semi-automatic pistols [65]
4 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting 2012 27 (plus 1 perp.) 2 Semi-automatic rifle and pistol [65]
5 Sutherland Springs church shooting 2017 26 (plus 1 perp.)[fn 1] 20 Semi-automatic rifle [67][66]
6 Luby's shooting1991 23 (plus 1 perp.) 27 Semi-automatic pistols [65]
7 El Paso shooting 2019 22 24 Semi-automatic rifle [68][69]
8 San Ysidro McDonald's massacre1984 21 (plus 1 perp.) 19 Semi-automatic carbine, pistols, and shotgun [65]
9 Stoneman Douglas High School shooting 2018 17 17 Semi-automatic rifle [70]
10 University of Texas tower shooting1966 16 (plus 1 perp. plus 1 victim who died in 2001[fn 1] 31 Rifles, revolver, pistols, and shotgun [65]
Studies also show that the frequency rate tripled between 2011 and 2015. In 2015 we hit about one mass shooting per day in this country (mainly domestic violence). As of August 9, 2019 we have had 251 mass shootings in 216 days (mainly domestic violence).
Also according to the conservative New York Times: "According to The New York Times, the majority of perpetrators they have published stories about are white males who act alone.[40] According to most analyses and studies however, the proportion of mass shooters in the United States who are white is not considerably greater than the proportion of white people in the general population of the US.[41]"
I have said this before and I'll say it again, this isn't a Trump or racist problem as much as America has been losing it's sense of right and wrong for decades now. We are losing our soul.
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Legitimate argument. I would counter that a dedicated serial killer would find other means for the same destruction ie bombs and that there is no legitimate way to rid the country of the existing assault weapons. Need to change the culture.
Okay, so what in particular is it about America that leads to this that doesn't exist anywhere else?
That is a damn good question! One that needs to gestate in the collective mind of America, instead of everybody just jumping to superficial conclusions and answers. It’ll only begin to turn around when we ask really good questions without thinking we already know the answers. I get it...some answers make sense and are necessary bandages to the wound but this runs so much deeper than we are collectively hitting at this time.
That right there is the million dollar question.
You can’t look at any other country as a direct comparison to The United States. There is no country that has what we have both negative and positive. A lot of the things that we have (and take for granted) don’t exist in any other country and that’s probably what makes the problems we face today in all facets of life. Unlike countries like Mexico or The Middle East the majority of issues plaguing our country aren’t directly tied to poverty, lack of education, political corruption, gangs etc.
We live in a country with a 24 news cycle that spews their agenda from both sides. I’m not here to say who’s right but there is a fundamental breakdown in commutation between parties/leaders and members of the media. Everybody has taken a side and it seems like we’re in this sort of trench warefare where nobody is willing to cede an inch and unfortunately that idea of not working together it seems to be creating more and more division to where it’s almost becoming a genuine hatred between people with different ideologies. Whatever issue it is, the economy, foreign relations, taxation, health care.... is there one thing that both parties agree on? It seems like the current political strategy in Washington is: If you’re President use executive orders. If you have a majority of the House/Senate vote along party lines and push it through.
And then you look at culturally we live in this entertainment driven world and with social media the way it is there’s this sort of attention whore mentality that people have nowadays. People seem like they want to be “Internet famous” to the the extent that they’re willing to post degrading photos of their own kids, or parents in the hospital on their death bed. Then you have people going to the grocery store and lick ice cream and put it back. What the heck is that?
I saw some of the videos of the shooting from inside Wal-Mart and from the parking lot, that stuff was horrific. It was tough to watch people videotaping the incident to networking sites such as Facebook Live or Instagram. One lady was videotaping and running back and forth across the parking lot hysterically, and I felt bad because people are shot/dead all around her and her reaction is to videotape and not to render first aid or get to safety. I know that lady was jacked up emotionally, I get that but your first reaction should not be to get your phone out. I just find it hard to think that those people thought “Oh my God, I need to videotape this for the prosecution.” And as bad those people felt I can only imagine somebody watching those clips and seeing their family/friends dead. That’s beyond awful.
I can go on and on but you throw in other things like drug epidemic in this country, and social issues that are hot button topics like immigration and Black Lives Matter and the Me Too movement, there are just a million things that seem to be creating this storm.
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I agree with that. I do think redefining our laws in regards to guns (assault rifles, obtaining guns, etc) will make it more difficult for someone to go on such a rampage, however I agree with you that there would probably be an increase in the Timothy McVeighs, James Alex Fields Jrs, Unabombers, and probably even the Ted Bundys of the world. Because there exists in these people a genuine desire to kill, and kill big.
Lest you all forget, not long ago France saw a massacre worse than any American shooting.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...astille-day-crowd-in-nice-killing-at-least-70
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...astille-day-crowd-in-nice-killing-at-least-70
There's a very interesting article I would encourage posters to read. It's hypothesis is that the United States measures similarly to Western Europe in terms of crime. Crime in America is just more lethal due to accessibility of guns. For me it rings true. Only in the accessibility to guns are we outliers.
I do not think the British or the Spanish are better than we are. They just have better laws. And while terrible things happen everywhere I would take any developed country's homicide rates over ours.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/2015/8/27/9217163/america-guns-europe
I do not think the British or the Spanish are better than we are. They just have better laws. And while terrible things happen everywhere I would take any developed country's homicide rates over ours.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/2015/8/27/9217163/america-guns-europe
We're currently in our 2nd civil war, Mr. 2Step. Wars don't start when armies start firing at each other. They start when civilizations are divided and citizens are fighting each other as Tяump has done with ours. We're already there.
I take it you weren't happy with Bill Clinton. I don't know about the racist part but the rest fits him.
